are knee problems common among electrical workers?

[soothsayer]

I'm an apprentice taking an OSHA class as part of a work-study program at Empire state college. Part of this class has to deal with writing a large research paper with an occupational health focus. I've heard, through many people I work with, and through anecdotal evidence, that many electricians seem to suffer knee and joint problems, and that may have something to do with climbing up and down ladders, age, etc. Because of this, I've decided to analyze and write about knee pain among electricians.

For this paper, I am corrolating bureau of labor studies occupational health data along with personal interviews, and additional statistics obtained locally. I'm also trying to poll members of the electricial industry locally here on my end about their experiences, but that has been a bit difficult because of scheduling conflicts, but i'm trying. so.....

I'm hoping if you guys can help me a little, and if the admin of this forum would permit, to let me post a link to a quick 10 question survey on knee pain. it is completely anonymous questionnaire. this will help me add another dimension to my research.

thank you.

knee survey
http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.asp?u=351252939246

 

[iwire]

I filled out your survey.

It happens I have a lot of problems with my knees and feet, both hereditary and work related.

 

[JohnJ0906]

I filled it out too. I do know that we seem to have to kneel more than a lot of other trades, as well as a lot of ladder work. If I install recepticles longer than a few hours, my knees bother me some.

 

[George Stolz]

I've been at this for over four years now, and at this point, only kneeling at receptacles causes pain. Then again, I've never been able to maintain a kneeling position (baseball catcher's stance), and have never attempted to do that while installing receptacles or stripping them out.

In residential, where seeing into the back of the box was not necessary for me, I would simply bend at the waist and strip them out from essentially a standing position. On cold days when the romex wouldn't strip, I'd have to get on my knees to get the job done.


Click to enlarge

I started using this rolling seat for trimming out receptacles, it made the job go a lot easier and faster. Unfortunately, people's first impression is "you're not working hard if you're sitting down." Given the widespread complaints of knee problems from electricians, you'd think they'd be more understanding, but some aren't.

I don't know how much your poll is going to tell you, to be honest. I'd consider adding more factors such as height, weight, lifestyle, etc, to get a more complete picture.

My sister was born with club feet, and had multiple surgeries to be able to walk. After high school, she has gained (IMO) too much weight for her already stressed structure to bear, and has had extensive knee problems. She works behind a desk now. I am tall and skinny, but my bad nutrition and lack of exercise probably contributes as much as anything to my discomfort.

It is a complex problem.

 

[Rockyd]

Did the survey. I've had two minor knee surgery's (scoped) and thank my orthopedic for a great job. When trimming receptacles, I try to at least throw down a piece of cardboard down while I bow to the hole. The other end of the stick I've noticed is the amount of rotary cuff damage in the shoulder that exists (troffer wear and tear). Made friends with Cortesone once or twice, and a bottle of Alleve is somewhere close at hand if the day wants to be ugly.

Edit spelling...

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

Knees kneed good protection

Knees kneed good protection

When I was young in the trades, I thought that I could conquer the world and I took physical punishment like a man. I would do all the stupid things one should not do, as I was in excellent shape and wanted everyone else to know that.

Well, 30 some odd years later, I can tell you it was pure STUPIDITY on my part.
Today I would definitely do things differently.
1. I would not jump down from heights.
2. I would not crawl on my knees without very good protection - they make excellent knee protection today that is fairly comfortable.
3. I would not kneel down on cold surfaces without some kind of protection.
4. I would not stop excercising as I got older. I stopped any kind of real excercising about 4 years ago... I feel much older physically because of this fact. 7 years ago I ran a 10 k race and placed 3 overall and 1st in my age group... today I am lucky that I can walk up 6 flights of stairs without being winded. (inspecting taller buildings when the elevator is not in operation)
4. I would not stand on ladders for any length of time, taking a short break would probably make a big difference.
5. Did I say I would wear good knee protection... I cannot stress how much of a difference it makes. In the last couple of years in my working days, I finally did use the good protection (I could not kneel down without it), it amazed me how good it fealt to kneel down with the protection on. DUMB, DUMB, DUMB!!!

For you young guys... take heed of an older guys advice, do not worry what you look like on the job, take the necessary precautions.

 

[JohnJ0906]

My second or third day in the trade I was told not to sit down while trimming out recepticles. What did I know back then? Even now I hear that a lot. I do like that stool George. If it had a little shelf underneath, I would get one fast. I think I need to start looking!

 

[George Stolz]

I do like that stool George. If it had a little shelf underneath, I would get one fast. I think I need to start looking!

Sears sells one with a shelf underneath, I believe, for mechanics. It's kind of a mini bar stool. There's many different styles of those with tool trays, I avoid them because they take up a lot of space. The one I have collapses down for storage and takes up very little space.

The problem I have with kneepads is, they cut off circulation to my feet, which is also uncomfortable. But there are occasions when kneepads would be more handy than a stool, for certain.

 

[iwire]

But there are occasions when kneepads would be more handy than a stool, for certain.

More than we need to know....

 

[George Stolz]

I can't believe that took that long.

 

[allenwayne]

My second or third day in the trade I was told not to sit down while trimming out recepticles. What did I know back then? Even now I hear that a lot. I do like that stool George. If it had a little shelf underneath, I would get one fast. I think I need to start looking!

Look for a round mechanics stool they have a pnematic height adjustment and a tray under them.I have one that has 5 casters.Works great for trim outs.I never had knee troubles over the years but cervical (neck) problems have caused me alot of pain over the years from constantly being on a ladder and looking up.I did find a non invasive surgery that worked 110% for that though.

 

[acrwc10]

But there are occasions when kneepads would be more handy than a stool, for certain.

I know you ment something differant, But I know a tile man that calls them "San Fransisco bedroom slippers".

 

[electricguy61]

Sears sells one with a shelf underneath, I believe, for mechanics. It's kind of a mini bar stool. There's many different styles of those with tool trays, I avoid them because they take up a lot of space. The one I have collapses down for storage and takes up very little space.

The problem I have with kneepads is, they cut off circulation to my feet, which is also uncomfortable. But there are occasions when kneepads would be more handy than a stool, for certain.

Sometimes those gardening kneel pads (@ 6" x 12" x 1" made of dense foam) work the best.

 

[allenwayne]

I know you ment something differant, But I know a tile man that calls them "San Fransisco bedroom slippers".

Now that made me fall off my chair.SF bedroom slippers lol.lol.lol.lol

 

[soothsayer]

I don't know how much your poll is going to tell you, to be honest. I'd consider adding more factors such as height, weight, lifestyle, etc, to get a more complete picture.

It is a complex problem.

you're absolutely right. i've made a slight mistake in designing this survey, i did a more throughout reading of the literature, and found references where weight (being overweight) and to some extent, one's genetics, factors greatly on whether or not a person has knee pain, and more troubling, osteoarthritis. I didn't add in the "do you consider yourself overweight" aspect to the survey. i will have to mention this fact in my paper.

as for lifestyle factors, that appears to be a more complicated variable to quantify.

thanks for all your replies.

 

[paul32]

I assume the talk of trimming receptacles is for the around 15" off the floor ones. Maybe different things work for different people. The first thing I tried was a chair--always gave me a backache. I got kneepads to kneel, but still found I had to bend to reach the box (as others have said) and still got a backache. I tend to never need kneepads now. I found to sit on the floor (cross-legged) in front of the receptacle is most comfortable, both for trim out and box make up.

 

[jshaw]

I have been doing this kind of work since I was a kid. I discovered the rolling mechanics stool years ago for installing receptacles. It works great and took alot of stress off my back and knees. I have found, now that I am much older, that there is more stress on arms and shoulders from reaching, pulling, and hammering. I have had carpel tunnel surgery both hands, ulner nerve surgery on both elbows and one shoulder rotator cuff and bicep tendons totally re-built. Let's face it, electrical work is very strenous and it's important to make every effort to take care of our bodies if we can.

 

[ceknight]

I tend to never need kneepads now. I found to sit on the floor (cross-legged) in front of the receptacle is most comfortable, both for trim out and box make up.

That's exactly what I do as well. I also take off the side bags and lay them on the floor nearby, so everything's at hand and I don't have to contort to get tools and supplies out of them.

I've hit that certain age and girth where this is by far the most comfortable position to work on boxes that are near the floor. And being self-employed means there's no foreman there to make fun of me while I'm doing it.

 

[hey_poolboy]

I'm too young for these problems. I tore up my knees by doing stupid things while wrestling in H.S. My doc tells me I will probably be talking about surgery by 40.

Knees are alot like hearing. You never think to protect them until the damage is already done.

 

[allenwayne]

That's exactly what I do as well. I also take off the side bags and lay them on the floor nearby, so everything's at hand and I don't have to contort to get tools and supplies out of them.

I've hit that certain age and girth where this is by far the most comfortable position to work on boxes that are near the floor. And being self-employed means there's no foreman there to make fun of me while I'm doing it.

Afew years ago we were swammped by trim outs.The owner decided that the supers had to pitch in and we went as a 10 man crew to trim out like 10 houses in a day.I had to wd 40 the owners side cutters to get them to open .He sat on the floor like an indian in front of a fire.As a side note i had to help him up from each box he sat in front of.So much for desk work LOL LOL LOL