[B]Beginning an Education![/B]

[m198power]

Hi All.

i'd like to be an electrician. (you never heard that before, lol) I live in Easton, PA. I put in an application with the union here, but they said the process takes at least a year, so I am not banking on this job. I've put in applications with larger electrical companies in Allentown, PA to be a helper, but have heard nothing. I've looked for schooling and all I can find is places in and around philly and one place in North central jersey. All of em over an hr away.

I'm trying to develop a plan to get into the trade, but I am not sure what I can do. I have a BA and I was an Army Officer. Now I'm 27 and looking for a career. I really enjoy construction and I would like to do this, but I don't know the best way. I keep my eyes peeled in want ads for a helper, but have seen little, and when i do call and leave a message, i get nothing. I know ask myself how anyone gets the ball rolling in this business in this area. I know there is work, people tend to complain when their lights don't go on!

What are your thoughts...I'm looking for courses of action.

I've put in applicaitons to other, completely different jobs, but I want to work construction. I love being outside and I'll take the good with the bad over some desk job in a cubicle with a synthetic temp of 72 degrees.

 

[haskindm]

Everyone is looking for good helpers, but these positions are usually not advertised. Take some basic electrical classes at your local community college and keep calling on businesses in your area. Let them know that you can be relied on. Let them know that you are willing to attend classes and progress in the trade. Show them your military experience, anything that seperates you from the other applications that they have on file. Remember you are applying for a "helper" job, don't try to impress them with what you already know. Emphasize that you are willing to learn and that you know you have alot to learn.

 

[HKYPLR]

Hi All.

i'd like to be an electrician. (you never heard that before, lol) I live in Easton, PA. I put in an application with the union here, but they said the process takes at least a year, so I am not banking on this job. I've put in applications with larger electrical companies in Allentown, PA to be a helper, but have heard nothing. I've looked for schooling and all I can find is places in and around philly and one place in North central jersey. All of em over an hr away.

I'm trying to develop a plan to get into the trade, but I am not sure what I can do. I have a BA and I was an Army Officer. Now I'm 27 and looking for a career. I really enjoy construction and I would like to do this, but I don't know the best way. I keep my eyes peeled in want ads for a helper, but have seen little, and when i do call and leave a message, i get nothing. I know ask myself how anyone gets the ball rolling in this business in this area. I know there is work, people tend to complain when their lights don't go on!

What are your thoughts...I'm looking for courses of action.

I've put in applicaitons to other, completely different jobs, but I want to work construction. I love being outside and I'll take the good with the bad over some desk job in a cubicle with a synthetic temp of 72 degrees.

Some people might not belive that a man as educated as you would be willing to take a lesser position. But I'm sure if you traveled a little in to NJ or you went to a supply house maybe even taking a job in a supply house (you would see Electricians every day) and asked around you could pick up somthing.
Great Luck and THANK YOU !!

 

[jeff43222]

There is a surplus of electricians in many areas of the country, and getting into a union is generally not easy, especially when they have lots of members who are out of work. One local in my area is even laying off apprentices, which is unusual since they aren't paid nearly as much as licensed journeymen.

I went through something similar a while back and decided to be an electrician rather than sit in a cubicle all day doing boring work. After doing it for a while, I decided that being in a cubicle isn't so bad if the work is interesting. I now work full-time as an engineer and only play electrician a little bit on the side.

If I were in your shoes, I'd think about going back to school. I, too, have a BA and a military background (navy), and I went back to school and got a BS in EE. Working as an electrician has some downsides you may not be considering, and there are plenty of members of this board who have said that the job has caused a lot of wear and tear on their bodies over the years.

You don't necessarily have to be a complete cubicle slave. Consider going to school for construction management or engineering. Both career paths can feature a fair amount of field time. One engineer in my group is in the field most of the time supervising a power plant that's being built.

 

[HKYPLR]

There is a surplus of electricians in many areas of the country, and getting into a union is generally not easy, especially when they have lots of members who are out of work. One local in my area is even laying off apprentices, which is unusual since they aren't paid nearly as much as licensed journeymen.

I went through something similar a while back and decided to be an electrician rather than sit in a cubicle all day doing boring work. After doing it for a while, I decided that being in a cubicle isn't so bad if the work is interesting. I now work full-time as an engineer and only play electrician a little bit on the side.

If I were in your shoes, I'd think about going back to school. I, too, have a BA and a military background (navy), and I went back to school and got a BS in EE. Working as an electrician has some downsides you may not be considering, and there are plenty of members of this board who have said that the job has caused a lot of wear and tear on their bodies over the years.

You don't necessarily have to be a complete cubicle slave. Consider going to school for construction management or engineering. Both career paths can feature a fair amount of field time. One engineer in my group is in the field most of the time supervising a power plant that's being built.

Jeff
We know you were only kidding about side stuff, right ?

 

[George Stolz]

Hockeyplayer, click here to see Jeff's job-profile. That should clear it up for you.

 

[jeff43222]

Jeff
We know you were only kidding about side stuff, right ?

George beat me to it...

 

[HKYPLR]

George beat me to it...

Jeff
As long as you have the correct license/ insurance no problem, but wouldn't you rather be a full time EC ?
You know being as smart as you are and all.

 

[jeff43222]

I used to be a full-time EC, but I decided I wanted to focus more on engineering, so I made the switch. So far, it's going pretty well.

And don't let my spelling prowess fool you. I'm one of those people who actually is as dumb as he looks.

 

[m198power]

thanks for the info gent's

I had an interview for a job today and was told they are looking for experienced folks, specifically 6 full time electricians, and that they are always looking for good help. The problem was that this company doesn't have any time to hold a newbie's hand, they said they are just too busy.

I did get info for schooling though and they told me to come back when I know a little theory. Long story short I went to the community college just trying to develop a game plan and left a student. I start a class on the 25th on Electrical Code, my textbook is "Mike Holts Illustrated Guide to Electrical NEC Exam Preparation," lol. Their electrician class schedule is all screwy so that was the only one I could take, but all the classes run in non-standard time frames (i.e. not jan to may and sept to dec). It will take a little over a year to complete the 7 classes (total length for each class is a little over 3 months (if the other classes are like the ones I'm currently scheduled to take)and some I will be able to take at the same time).

The description said this course selection is designed for industrial and construction electricians.

I prefer to think and plan rather than react, but I was short on time and I figured I'd follow Patton's advice, which severed me well in the Army..." A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow"

What do you think?

 

[celtic]

Did you get my PM?

 

[tallgirl]

I used to be a full-time EC, but I decided I wanted to focus more on engineering, so I made the switch. So far, it's going pretty well.

And don't let my spelling prowess fool you. I'm one of those people who actually is as dumb as he looks.

Ooooo, and I thought that avatar was a picture of your dog. I didn't know it was a picture of you!

(Ducking, grinning and running!)

But seriously, if I were looking to switch from framing to electrical, I'd try to get on with a company that has inhouse framers and eletricians. Then try and pick up the material handling skills from cow-orkers.

 

[HKYPLR]

thanks for the info gent's

I had an interview for a job today and was told they are looking for experienced folks, specifically 6 full time electricians, and that they are always looking for good help. The problem was that this company doesn't have any time to hold a newbie's hand, they said they are just too busy.

I did get info for schooling though and they told me to come back when I know a little theory. Long story short I went to the community college just trying to develop a game plan and left a student. I start a class on the 25th on Electrical Code, my textbook is "Mike Holts Illustrated Guide to Electrical NEC Exam Preparation," lol. Their electrician class schedule is all screwy so that was the only one I could take, but all the classes run in non-standard time frames (i.e. not jan to may and sept to dec). It will take a little over a year to complete the 7 classes (total length for each class is a little over 3 months (if the other classes are like the ones I'm currently scheduled to take)and some I will be able to take at the same time).

The description said this course selection is designed for industrial and construction electricians.

I prefer to think and plan rather than react, but I was short on time and I figured I'd follow Patton's advice, which severed me well in the Army..." A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow"

What do you think?

Gen. Patton
Is the class you are about to take a 1st year class ? The Mike Holt book is a GREAT BOOK, but it talks about things you should know already. You need a basic Electricity class, then a code class. The code tells you a minimum standard to install electrical stuff. No place in the code does it tell you how to wire a 3 way switch (which to a new person would sound like a dumb name unless someone took the time to explain it to you). I think it is GREAT that you are trying to learn but try to get the theory first.
CARRY ON

 

[brian john]

Please, Please move to the Washington DC, we need good help Union or non union (Though I have my prferences). Good pay, nice benefits, retirement, health care. Now for the rub expensive housing and traffic. But the local apprentices do OK and after school the wages are decent.

 

[m198power]

Gen. Patton
Is the class you are about to take a 1st year class ? The Mike Holt book is a GREAT BOOK, but it talks about things you should know already. You need a basic Electricity class, then a code class. The code tells you a minimum standard to install electrical stuff. No place in the code does it tell you how to wire a 3 way switch (which to a new person would sound like a dumb name unless someone took the time to explain it to you). I think it is GREAT that you are trying to learn but try to get the theory first.
CARRY ON

haha opps,
well, to late now. I guess I'll swim the best I can with lead shoes...I hope the water isn't choppy!!
The class does start on the 25th, which means I have a few days, specifically the weekend, to do some reading. I guess I'll put down my tax book I've been reading and pick-up something on basic electricity at barnes and noble. lol

 

[tonyou812]

You want to work out doors? There's nothing very fun about being in a bucket truck 30 feet in the air when its 0 degrees out. And you really should take your courses in a different order why start with a code class? You really should take some theory courses first than your residential,commercial,industrial, etc... It will make more sense to you that way.

 

[m198power]

You want to work out doors? There's nothing very fun about being in a bucket truck 30 feet in the air when its 0 degrees out. And you really should take your courses in a different order why start with a code class? You really should take some theory courses first than your residential,commercial,industrial, etc... It will make more sense to you that way.

I went to the college to develop a plan and they told me I didn't have to wait until next semester, I could start in a few days. So I said Lets do it. They went through the all the courses I wanted to take and said that this was the only one class I could take. It's 3 months long and meets 2 days a week, I don't expect it to be so hard that I will not be able to pass. My next class, which is also 3 months long, is Fundamentals in Electricity, which starts about a week after this class ends.

Following what seems to be the consensus that I am starting off on the wrong foot, I bought a book and basic electricty, and will read it before class starts on thurs.

So basically, I didn't know I was starting out of order, however, if I did know, I still would have made the same decision. Why? Doing something is usually better than doing nothing and for someone like me, who can't sit still, doing something is all I will ever do.

Here are the names of the classes I will be taking over the course of the next year, what do you think?


Electrical Wiring 1
Electrical Wiring 2
Electrical Code ----I start on Thurs
Electrical Fundamentals ---I start in about 3+ months
Electrical Motors and Controls
Industrical Control Systems 1
Industrical Control Systems 2

 

[m198power]

Here are the course descriptions...

ELTC 107 Electrical Wiring I (Cr2)(1.5:1)
Practices of electrical wiring with a focus on residential single and multi-family dwellings; project planning, materials calculation, and NEC-based installation and wiring practices. Formerly ELTC 807. Prereq. - EMEC 101.


ELTC 109 Electrical Wiring II (Cr3)(3:1)
Practices of electrical wiring with a focus on commercial buildings; project planning, materials calculation, and NEC-based installation and wiring practices. Formerly ELTC 809.
Prereq. - ELTC 107.

ELTC 111 Electrical Code (Cr3)(3:0)
Interpretation and application of the current release of the National Electrical Code; branch and feeder circuits, service entrances, switches, switch boards and panel boards, general equipment, and motor circuits. Formerly ELTC 811.

ELEC 101 DC/AC Circuit Analysis I (Cr4)(3:3)
Introduction to the fundamentals of DC and AC circuit theory. Topics include: definition of voltage, current, resistance, and power; Ohm?s and Kirchhoff?s laws; and series and parallel circuit analysis. Concepts of magnetism and sine waves as they relate to electronics are introduced. Lab work emphasizes schematic reading, equipment operation, and data taking. Prereq. - Evidence of score of 500 or higher on SAT mathematics exam or 11th grade PSSA mathematics score of 1300 or higher, or completion of MATH 026 or 028 with C or better or appropriate competence in mathematics as determined by the mathematics placement test.

EMEC 135 Electrical Motors and Controls (Cr4)(3:2)
Concepts of electricity, electronics and controls related to industrial applications; industrial control devices and sensors; relays and electromechanical control; electrical diagrams; transformers and power distribution; solid state power devices; motors, starters and drives; AC/DC motor control; process control fundamentals. Prereq. - EMEC 101.


ELTC 240 Electrical Construction Technology IV (Cr6)(4:5)
Covers lightning protection, introduction to optoelectronics, AC and DC motor construction, operation and installation, AC and DC motor controls, drives and clutches, introduction to Boolean algebra, logic gates and digital circuits, AC and DC drives, PLC basics, air conditioning and refrigeration basics, and conductor and motor sizing. Prereq. - ELTC 230.

EMEC 245 Industrial Control Systems II (Cr3)(2:2)
Analog control systems, PLC analog control systems including set point and PID control operation and programming; networking PLC?s, information exchange, peer to peer, peer to host, host to peer communications; operator interfaces, human machine interface (HMI).
Prereq. - EMEC 240.

 

[George Stolz]

This may sound bad, but I'll say it anyway. The whole appeal of this trade for me when I started is that I could make a decent amount of money in a short amount of time with minimal investment upfront. I have never taken a class, aside from an impromptu apprentice class held by my old shop once a month.

It seems to me as though you're getting the cart in front of the horse. Basically, as I see it, you're buying a nice new stereo and speakers for a car you haven't bought yet. I think maybe the guy that started you on this sequence of events was giving you advice that sounded good, instead of sound advice.

Classes can enhance the experience, but it's not a substitute for experience. The industry would be better off if all electricians had to attend classes (many states require this).

If you get a job with an electrical contractor (whether in your area or in some of the areas suggested above), it could be that they might pay your way through some of these classes, or help out.

Your personal education will not improve the market in your area; if there is a sagging market, you may not land a job locally after you've taken all your courses either, for lack of experience.

Anyway, IMO, continuing education is a tool to enhance the experience gained throughout the day, and would not be as effective as a groundwork for experience yet to be gained. This is just my opinion, and I could be wrong, but I felt compelled to say this. I hate to be one to cast doubt on your decision after you've already paid for the course and are set on this path of action, but I'm pitching this out there anyway. Good luck, and I hope it works out for you.

 

[tallgirl]

Maybe it's just that I grew up learning electrical theory, but for a BASIC code class, which is how I read that course description, I don't think much beyond Ohm's Law is a requirement. Kirchoff's Law might come in handy as well, but I don't think he's going to drown without the electric theory coursework first.

Now, I do think that without either industry experience, or at least one of the electrical wiring courses, he's going to have trouble understanding the jargon and whatnot. The sections of the code I understand the least are the ones I've never had anything to do with, hands-on-wise.