bath fan Mechanical permit

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Greg1707

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Location
Alexandria, VA
Occupation
Business owner Electrical contractor
Today I went to get a permit for installing a bath exhaust fan. I have done this many times without a problem. Today I was told (for the first time ever) that I needed a mechanical permit since the fan is vented outside and that since I do not have a master's license in HVAC I could not get a permit to install the fan. Although I was pretty upset by this I suggested that they give me an electrical permit for the fan and that I would subcontract the vent. I was told they could not do that since the fan required a vent and since I did not have the license etc.....

Am I the only electrical contractor in town without a HVAC? Does everyone out there installing fans have both a master's electrical and HVAC?
I guess I will need to take another exam in order to install a $30 exhaust fan!
 
All the builders I work with except for one has the HVAC guys install the duct. I have one builder that insists I install the ductwork. I did check w/ the BO before doing the job the first time and they had no problem with it. Here's a question: why are you buying permits to install an exhaust fan? Are there no exceptions for jobs that are under a certain cost?
 
brantmacga said:
Here's a question: why are you buying permits to install an exhaust fan? Are there no exceptions for jobs that are under a certain cost?
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In my area, price of work has nothing to do with need for a permit, a $5 job if there was such a thing would require a permit, and inspection.

What sense does it make to allow a job that costs $100 which might be in violation, slide without inspection, then a job that costs $500 need an inspection. What are they thinking?
 
we're not required to buy permits for small jobs such as installing an exhaust fan, adding a recep, light, etc. . . but we are responsible as contractors to perform the job correctly.
 
brantmacga said:
we're not required to buy permits for small jobs such as installing an exhaust fan, adding a recep, light, etc. . . but we are responsible as contractors to perform the job correctly.
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So what is their thinking based on, that one recpt can't burn the building down, but 100 can?

We are all responsible as contractors to perform the job correctly, inspection is to insure that we are doing it correct. Sounds like some real wild west there.
 
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yep they're burning down everyday. i believe the ibc also makes mention of no permit required for jobs under a certain price range.
 
ITO said:
How do you find jobs and make money getting permits for service calls?
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Permits are not required for repair work on service calls, in our area, only for installation work, the discussion was not refering to service calls it was on installation, and my question was how do you base a need for inpection on an installation using price of job, how does that assure work practices of jobs done under the price limit.

Your not likely to get a fire from every bad wiring job, but there are other hazzards that can arise from bad work, my point was how did they decide to use the price of a job as a need for inspection.
 
The real question is why isn't the electrician an capable of installing a bathroom fan correctly in the first place? This is a task so simple a monkey could do it. Besides that, if a permit is pulled and it's getting inspected I fail to see why their is any need for an HVAC contractor to install a piece of flex duct and a cap on the end. This wouldn't matter here in NJ since there are no HVAC licenses anyway.
 
infinity said:
The real question is why isn't the electrician an capable of installing a bathroom fan correctly in the first place?
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That is a real good question, I seem to find them just ducted to the attic space, but I think the real problem is dryer ducting and hoods... IMO.
 
satcom said:
Permits are not required for repair work on service calls, in our area, only for installation work, the discussion was not refering to service calls it was on installation, and my question was how do you base a need for inpection on an installation using price of job, how does that assure work practices of jobs done under the price limit.

Your not likely to get a fire from every bad wiring job, but there are other hazzards that can arise from bad work, my point was how did they decide to use the price of a job as a need for inspection.
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With all due respect, installing an exhaust fan in a bathroom is a service call.
 
ITO said:
installing an exhaust fan in a bathroom is a service call.
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From a business standpoint I can see that.

From a permitting standpoint I would call that a new install and in my state I would be required to get a permit and inspection.
 
How would you feel if you were told that a Manual J calculation was needed to see if the current HVAC system could make up for the looses from the exhaust fan.

Don't laugh, I know from people the that this has happened to.

This is also where the mechanical guys were issued stop work orders for not pulling electrical permits for their thermostat wires. This was on a new mega mall.
 
Service call

Service call

Thanks for all of the responses to my post regarding the venting of an exhaust fan. You are right in that this was a service call. The fan is for a 50 year old house without any bath fans. After reading all of your comments something suddenly made sense of my experience. The people in the permit office asked me several times where was my building permit and where were my plans. I was really confused by this but now it makes sense. It appears that the only people pulling permits for bath fans must be contractors working with new construction or remodeling. Thus the confusion about needing plans and mechanical permits for my little job. If contractors were pulling permits everyday for my type of job there probably would not have been the confusion.
 
Greg1707 said:
Thanks for all of the responses to my post regarding the venting of an exhaust fan. You are right in that this was a service call. The fan is for a 50 year old house without any bath fans. After reading all of your comments something suddenly made sense of my experience. The people in the permit office asked me several times where was my building permit and where were my plans. I was really confused by this but now it makes sense. It appears that the only people pulling permits for bath fans must be contractors working with new construction or remodeling. Thus the confusion about needing plans and mechanical permits for my little job. If contractors were pulling permits everyday for my type of job there probably would not have been the confusion.
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Greg, IMO if you went there to repair something, that would be a service call, when you go there to install a fan for a 50 year old house, without any bath fans, that is an installation on a remodel job.
 
I worked a guy once who insisted, in his own little private world, at least, that the venting of anything should be the responsobility of the HVAC crew. Electricians should hang and wire the fan, but HVAC should vent it. :rolleyes:

I would not have considered a permit for the install or repair of a bathroom vent fan. It is not anything that has ever been pointed out to me so it never enters into my thinking. I am not sure it is anything a one or two man inspections office is too worried about around here. One of my favorite things about this web site is it forces me to think about things I never did before. And sometimes that makes me very unhappy. :wink:
 
infinity said:
The real question is why isn't the electrician an capable of installing a bathroom fan correctly in the first place? This is a task so simple a monkey could do it. Besides that, if a permit is pulled and it's getting inspected I fail to see why their is any need for an HVAC contractor to install a piece of flex duct and a cap on the end. This wouldn't matter here in NJ since there are no HVAC licenses anyway.
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most other trades would say the same thing about certain electrical work. how would you feel about them poaching into your area?
 
petersonra said:
most other trades would say the same thing about certain electrical work. how would you feel about them poaching into your area?
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Around here electrical work falls under the license and permit of the EC. The HVAC guy has nothing to do with work that isn't under his permit. As far as installing a piece of 4" flex duct and a plastic cap, the electrician is no less capable then the HVAC guy for that simple task. Personally if the contract said that the HVAC guy installs the ductwork then I could care less, but to require a separate HVAC contractor to perform what amounts to DIY work is somewhat absurd.
 
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