Best & Worst Customers Today

[jmellc]

Installed power for a water heater today, brought into job by a plumber friend. He finished first & customer tried to beat him down on price. He held firm. I heard him tell her my estimate for my work; I had said approx 250. I finished up & billed her for $225. She proceeded to tell me their quote had been for $200. I said it wasn't from me, that I had not been asked for a quote before the job. She called husband, had him tell me a woman on the phone had quoted $200, could I not help them out and do it for $200. I said I had not ever quoted $200 & I needed my money. He kept on. I said "I will just rip my work out and you can get someone else". I laid phone down (she was lucky I didn't throw it). I went for my tools & she followed "this is not necessary, we will pay you", etc. and "Please don't get so angry". I told her I was not trying to rip her off & it was not necessary for them to play their little games with me, that if someone had quoted them $200, they should have hired that co. to do the work. She gave me a credit card. I will know by Fri or Mon if it clears. If not, I block their driveway until they come up with cash.

Met with another customer later to settle up after a long tedious job. She appreciated all I'd done & added a $50 bonus for my hard work. That was a great way to end the day and relax a bit after having to fight the 1st customer.

 

[BattleCat]

You need to calm down a bit! Ripping out your work and blocking their driveway is a good way to get yourself (and company) into hot water.

It's happened to all of us.

Personally, I don't do anything without a signed quote beforehand anymore, that is what the iPad is for.

What you say was common, and I hated doing work knowing that when I was done and showed the invoice there was a 50% chance that they would complain and try to get me to lower it. So that's why all prices are agreed upon up front now. In the few cases in which I really won't know how long it'll take or what's involved, then we agree to T&M rate beforehand.

 

[jmellc]

I will not be walked on. I had a feeling when I saw a head scarf on her that I would be in for a hard time.

 

[John120/240]

In your situation I would give a written estimate before the job begins.

FWIW $225 for a water heater wiring is proably right on depending on the distance from the

panel, breaker, disconnect required etc etc.

Sterotyping based on dress is baseless. You can run across cheapskates who are white, black,

Jewish, Indian, etc. Other times you get the most appreacitive customer who will bend over

backwards to make the job easier.

A look in the mirror might be in order. "How do I come across to the customer"

 

[BattleCat]

I will not be walked on.

No one says that you should be.

But there is the right way and the wrong way to handle things. Having a signed contract and taking it to court would be the right way. Ripping out an installation (which may be illegal) and blocking someone's driveway (also probably illegal) is the wrong way.

I had a feeling when I saw a head scarf on her that I would be in for a hard time.

I do not follow. Is this some type of race thing?

 

[GerryB]

Installed power for a water heater today, brought into job by a plumber friend. He finished first & customer tried to beat him down on price. He held firm. I heard him tell her my estimate for my work; I had said approx 250. I finished up & billed her for $225. She proceeded to tell me their quote had been for $200. I said it wasn't from me, that I had not been asked for a quote before the job. She called husband, had him tell me a woman on the phone had quoted $200, could I not help them out and do it for $200. I said I had not ever quoted $200 & I needed my money. He kept on. I said "I will just rip my work out and you can get someone else". I laid phone down (she was lucky I didn't throw it). I went for my tools & she followed "this is not necessary, we will pay you", etc. and "Please don't get so angry". I told her I was not trying to rip her off & it was not necessary for them to play their little games with me, that if someone had quoted them $200, they should have hired that co. to do the work. She gave me a credit card. I will know by Fri or Mon if it clears. If not, I block their driveway until they come up with cash.

Met with another customer later to settle up after a long tedious job. She appreciated all I'd done & added a $50 bonus for my hard work. That was a great way to end the day and relax a bit after having to fight the 1st customer.

I know how you feel, I've had the exact same thing, plumber calls me and asks about how much, passes it along. It sounds like the woman just lied to you, but as the other posters have said you have to be real careful what you say or do. It ain't worth 200 bucks. And tips are cool! The first time I got one I was like "wow, electricians get tips?" So your day ended good and next time you can approach it differently.

 

[iwire]

I will not be walked on. .

No, but you might get arrested for ripping the work out.

In general once it is installed it is the customers even if not paid for yet.

 

[Hv&Lv]

Met with another customer later to settle up after a long tedious job. She appreciated all I'd done & added a $50 bonus for my hard work. That was a great way to end the day and relax a bit after having to fight the 1st customer.[/QUOTE]

I heard him tell her my estimate for my work; I had said approx 250.

I said it wasn't from me, that I had not been asked for a quote before the job.

:?

After the husband got home he got angry and called the credit card company and told them to do a charghback. Now you are out the $225 and the chargeback fees because you don't have the documentation needed to satisfy the credit card company.

Cash is king...

 

[roger]

In general once it is installed it is the customers even if not paid for yet.

And whether the OP knows it or not, it's that way in NC too.

Roger

 

[Ponchik]

I don't deal with races that are from certain parts of the world and I dont deal with my own race. Because they will drive me nuts. It doesn't matter how much you tell them, they will agree first then will try to beat you down on the price. Even if the project will cost $1 they will counter offer with $.50 . That is the way that their culture works. period.


As mentioned before the best way is Cash and check is better than credit card.

 

[GUNNING]

T R A D I T I O N!

T R A D I T I O N!

In general once it is installed it is the customers even if not paid for yet.

That way here too.

The negotiation after the sale is a middle eastern or even a third world custom. I call it market skills or Bazzar skills. If you don't negotiate with them they are insulted and think less of your skills as a merchant. You have inadvertently insulted there customs, expectations and your customer. You have to give a little and you will have an in with the rest of the clan if you want it. Knowing the rules of the bargain is the beginning. You are at fault for not including it in your price. If your customs wont let you participate in this practice get the agreement in writing. They don't understand the Walmart mentality of paying what is listed without haggling a little. It's an old OLD world custom.
Its like taking your shoes off when entering houses of Muslims or not being alone with the woman of the house without an elder male present. It's a custom. Look for clues like head scarf or shoes by the door or red dots on foreheads. That reminds me I need to get booties for the van. I wish I could find a cultural sensitivity seminar. Once the word gets out you know how to behave work flows in. Its a small community/town. Its like putting a phish on the back of the truck or wearing a beard instead of being clean shaven. It makes the customer comfortable in their chosen lifestyle.

 

[PetrosA]

That way here too.

The negotiation after the sale is a middle eastern or even a third world custom. I call it market skills or Bazzar skills. If you don't negotiate with them they are insulted and think less of your skills as a merchant. You have inadvertently insulted there customs, expectations and your customer. You have to give a little and you will have an in with the rest of the clan if you want it. Knowing the rules of the bargain is the beginning. You are at fault for not including it in your price. If your customs wont let you participate in this practice get the agreement in writing. They don't understand the Walmart mentality of paying what is listed without haggling a little. It's an old OLD world custom.
Its like taking your shoes off when entering houses of Muslims or not being alone with the woman of the house without an elder male present. It's a custom. Look for clues like head scarf or shoes by the door or red dots on foreheads. That reminds me I need to get booties for the van. I wish I could find a cultural sensitivity seminar. Once the word gets out you know how to behave work flows in. Its a small community/town. Its like putting a phish on the back of the truck or wearing a beard instead of being clean shaven. It makes the customer comfortable in their chosen lifestyle.

You're right that it's good to understand where your customer may be coming from, but that doesn't mean that we should be doing it that way here. Customs are a local privilege. The same way I would get the evil eye for taking a group of 20 Americans to a restaurant abroad and telling the waitperson at the end of the meal that we want separate checks, other people are going to get the evil eye here for expecting us to negotiate a price after the fact or work in their house without shoes on (yes, I've had customers ask me to take my boots off and one even made me work in a Tyvek suit so my germs wouldn't get in her house).

 

[GUNNING]

best call .. yesterday

best call .. yesterday

I was on my way to south FL to pick up my son for a 72 hour pass when a customer called "the power is out again in half the house and the appliances. She said she was starting the prep for Thanksgiving dinner when the power went out."
It is 4 hours down and 4 hours back. He hadn't been home since March.

I was 5 hours away, had been there 3 times in the last 2 years with the same problem and the same conclusion.
I explained what was going on and that I would guarantee they would have power on Turkey day. I was inventorying in my mind what I had that I could do this with. What could it be? Main Breaker outside? Service between pole and house? Main inside? Utility? Meter base? Lugs? Did I have any #4 in the scrap pile? How much pipe did I have and did I have any UF?
Here I only had 72 hours with Buddy and I was going to go dig in a new service to a Mobil double wide home in the dark.
The last two times I was there the power had reappeared before I got there. The last time I passed the utility trucks leaving. I got to talk to the crew a bit before they left. They said it wasn't on there side and there is a quad bad breaker buzzing to the stove. I have said the same thing to the owner repeatedly, "it has got to be the utility service.:?
In the dark heading on the 4 hour trip back I got a call.
The street was dark and when they fixed the street light there power came back on!
Took the town utility 2 years to fix the problem. I don't blame them, its a small town. But it made a very nice Turkey day for everyone. Thank you powers that be!
:angel:

 

[jmellc]

Truth is, I have long had friends from many parts of the world. Race is not an issue. But for the last 10 years or so, I have consistently found that people from the Middle East, India & Pakistan never cease in their bargaining. I fully understand wanting the best price they can find. In my mind, it is criminal to take it to 2nd & 3rd levels. I explained to her I could not do $200, then she had to call husband and have me fight with him too. If her father had been nearby, she probably would have called him too. Enough already. I suspect the $200 they spoke of was a lie. They could not tell me what co. gave it to them. I showed the woman every courtesy, talked "baby talk" with her toddler, showed her the new breaker in the panel that controlled the WH receptacle (tankless gas). I showed her what a tripped breaker looks like so she would know what to look for. My having to pad the bill to do discounts is not right either. Then they would say I was trying to inflate the bill and take advantage of them if they hadn't stood up to me. I do respect their culture, probably more than most people. But they are no longer in the Middle East. They need to respect our culture too. They chose to come and live here.

In fairness, I have also noticed that with the same people, those who grew up here or those married to Americans do things more the way we do.

A former boss got burned big time when he did some emergency work for an Indian merchant in the next town. He did a service call on Sat, got him safe for weekend. Mon morning, he called around for prices, made a quote & called customer with price, think it was $2,200 or so. He said come on. We stopped by supply house for materials, they were over $600. Got there & he told boss "his cousin" got the same job done for $500 & he wanted that price too. How many "same jobs" get done in this business for 2 cousins? He would not let us do the job and we left. Boss had $400 worth of cut wire he could not return. He did standard procedure at the time for customer wanting a price. Customer invented a story to beat him down with. Of course, he knows now, but having to go back for signed contract would mean another half day at least in doing that, then getting supplies afterward. If this man's word was not good, his signed contract would not be good either. He would find some way to squirm out of it. Going to court is often a waste of time & money too. A boss before him found that out.

If people want respect, they should give it. It is not a 1 way street. They should leave their 3rd World ways in the 3rd World. Maybe that is a clue why the 3rd World is so desperately poor.

 

[BattleCat]

Going to court is often a waste of time & money too. A boss before him found that out.

Every state is different, but in many states a lien is inexpensive and doesn't require court. A very politely typed up letter mailed with the invoice stating your intentions to file a lien after 30 days of non-receipt and the ramifications of the lien (original costs, late fees, lawyer costs) has always worked for me.

 

[jmellc]

No, but you might get arrested for ripping the work out.

In general once it is installed it is the customers even if not paid for yet.

Law or no law, she was close to losing her hot water.

In the future, I will get a signed agreement up front, as several of you have suggested. On bigger jobs, like my former boss, I will get a large deposit up front, or 100% cash in advance.

Thanks for listening.

 

[readydave8]

Georgia may be 3rd world, I gotten the same treatment from natives that y'all describe from immigrants. Only difference I've noticed is that immigrants get worse at understanding plain English whenever argument is not going their way.

 

[KVA]

I just had a gem of a customer today. They bought 2 new light fixtures to replace out by the front door and i told them $50 each because they looked easy and quick to swap and they hired me for other work. I get there today and they said oh we decided we aren't going to do the lights but they bought them and were sitting next to where i was working.

I look out in the living room and they bought a 65" LED flat screen, currently having tile done all over, just had brand new hardwood floors put in, replaced all the stucco on the front of the house and can drop $100 for me to install the lights?:lol:

People don't want to pay for electric work because it's mostly hidden and nobody thinks about it. People will fork over the bucks for luxuries without question.

Oh the whole time I'm working they are in and out Black Friday shopping.

 

[LEO2854]

Installed power for a water heater today, brought into job by a plumber friend. He finished first & customer tried to beat him down on price. He held firm. I heard him tell her my estimate for my work; I had said approx 250. I finished up & billed her for $225. She proceeded to tell me their quote had been for $200. I said it wasn't from me, that I had not been asked for a quote before the job. She called husband, had him tell me a woman on the phone had quoted $200, could I not help them out and do it for $200. I said I had not ever quoted $200 & I needed my money. He kept on. I said "I will just rip my work out and you can get someone else". I laid phone down (she was lucky I didn't throw it). I went for my tools & she followed "this is not necessary, we will pay you", etc. and "Please don't get so angry". I told her I was not trying to rip her off & it was not necessary for them to play their little games with me, that if someone had quoted them $200, they should have hired that co. to do the work. She gave me a credit card. I will know by Fri or Mon if it clears. If not, I block their driveway until they come up with cash.

Met with another customer later to settle up after a long tedious job. She appreciated all I'd done & added a $50 bonus for my hard work. That was a great way to end the day and relax a bit after having to fight the 1st customer.

There are many out there that will mess with you,(You say $300 they will say it's only wort $120 :blinkSo you will either get beat by the game or stand your ground and make them pay you what you are worth ,When they start this stuff it is the last time you will work for them anyhow so just stand up for yourself and get your money because they know they were trying to take you down so they will not be calling again.

As for the customer that gave you a tip , They will be calling again..:thumbsup:

 

[Speshulk]

Had a lady call about a year ago. Gave her a proposal for about $1,300 worth of work. I told her we'd do the work t&m and the $1,300 would be her worst case scenario. The job didn't take quite as long to do as I had anticipated, and the final bill was a little over $1,200. Believe it or not, she was upset with the bill. I was (and still am) dumbfounded. The fact that someone could get upset with being charged less than an estimate is a bit mind boggling.