Bonding gas pipes

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mcclary's electrical

Senior Member
Location
VA
The past two years I've noticed them getting alot more strict on how gas pipes get bonded. They used to consider it bonded by the egc of the equipment that is "likely" to energize the piping. But they are no longer letting this fly in all situations. I've been noticing it varies from county to county on how they are handling this. Some counties would let you size the bond by 250.122,,,,,,,,others would make you bond it by 250.66. It seems that if there is any csst on the job,,,,,anywhere, even a short piece behind the stove, it will not be considered bonded if done by 250.104(b),,,,,,,,,,that's only if there is no csst on the job, if they use csst,,,,,,you have to bond by a #6 solid. One manufacturer (wardflex)demands the same size wire as the GEC!!,,,,I think this is getting crazy,,,and the electrician is paying the price for the plumber using a inferior product!!
 

Cavie

Senior Member
Location
SW Florida
The past two years I've noticed them getting alot more strict on how gas pipes get bonded. They used to consider it bonded by the egc of the equipment that is "likely" to energize the piping. But they are no longer letting this fly in all situations. I've been noticing it varies from county to county on how they are handling this. Some counties would let you size the bond by 250.122,,,,,,,,others would make you bond it by 250.66. It seems that if there is any csst on the job,,,,,anywhere, even a short piece behind the stove, it will not be considered bonded if done by 250.104(b),,,,,,,,,,that's only if there is no csst on the job, if they use csst,,,,,,you have to bond by a #6 solid. One manufacturer (wardflex)demands the same size wire as the GEC!!,,,,I think this is getting crazy,,,and the electrician is paying the price for the plumber using a inferior product!!

Adjust you price accordingly.
 

mcclary's electrical

Senior Member
Location
VA
Never?? even before the use of csst???? that makes no sense. When it was always black pipe, it was considered bonded by the egc. When you say never,,,that seems strange. I've been in the field for 25 years and ten years ago nobody talked about gas pipe bond. Why would you use a #6 so long ago?
 

electricmanscott

Senior Member
Location
Boston, MA
If the NEC is the code of choice "they" are wrong when it comes to the standard black pipe. No need or requirement to run #6 or anything else for that matter.

I don't really think it is even required to bond gas pipe to begin with. But if you do the EGC of the circuit feeding equipment attached the the pipe is all that is required.

Inspector: Did you bond that gas pipe?
Me: Nope
Inspector: Why not?
Me: It is not likely to become energized I did a kick ass wiring job here.

:grin:
 

resistance

Senior Member
Location
WA
If the NEC is the code of choice "they" are wrong when it comes to the standard black pipe. No need or requirement to run #6 or anything else for that matter.

I don't really think it is even required to bond gas pipe to begin with. But if you do the EGC of the circuit feeding equipment attached the the pipe is all that is required.

Inspector: Did you bond that gas pipe?
Me: Nope
Inspector: Why not?
Me: It is not likely to become energized I did a kick ass wiring job here.

:grin:

I agree--seeing that the NEC isn't specific on how to determine the conditions in which gas pipes could become energized. We have a local requirement here for bonding flexible gas pipe. Which states: For flexible metal gas piping, installed new or extended from an existing rigid metal piping system, either:
(a) Provide a copy of the manufacturer?s bonding instructions to the inspector at the time of inspection and
follow those instructions; or
(b) The bonding conductor for the gas system must
(i) Must be a minimum 6 AWG copper; and
(ii) Terminate at:
(A) An accessible location at the gas meter end of the gas piping system on either a solid
iron gas pipe or a cast flexible gas piping fitting using a listed grounding connector;
and
(B) Either the service equipment enclosure, service grounding electrode conductor or
electrode, or neutral conductor bus in the service enclosure.

To add: Bonding metal pipes is a good idea, seeing that they are conductive, and will add additional safety.
 

Dennis Alwon

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
Not all flexible gas piping needs bonding. Omegaflex makes a product call counterstrike-- it is black , not yellow, and it does not need any extra bonding. Now, that being said I bond it just as I would any other CSST simply because I don't trust them. They screwed up before and I am not taking the chance now.
 

electricalperson

Senior Member
Location
massachusetts
do we actually have to put a clamp on the yellow CSST? what does that look like what what is it called? i havnt been on a job where they used this in probably 5 years. everybody uses black pipe for gas that i work with at least

i asked a plumber how do i bond it and he said "use a ground bar" i didnt know what he was talking about. he came over to fix my sewer and i asked him that question
 

electricmanscott

Senior Member
Location
Boston, MA
do we actually have to put a clamp on the yellow CSST? what does that look like what what is it called? i havnt been on a job where they used this in probably 5 years. everybody uses black pipe for gas that i work with at least

i asked a plumber how do i bond it and he said "use a ground bar" i didnt know what he was talking about. he came over to fix my sewer and i asked him that question

You attacch the clamp to the hard pipe that the flex is connected to.
 

electricalperson

Senior Member
Location
massachusetts
You attacch the clamp to the hard pipe that the flex is connected to.

only thing im worried about when it comes to bonding is what if the gas line is lower impedance than the water line? i dont think current on the gas pipe is a good idea. i dont know how the plumbers do it but they should stick some kind of dielectric coupling in the line
 

Dennis Alwon

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
Here is a excerpt from omegaflex.com trac pipe division.

CounterStrike is a patented CSST innovation based on our existing TracPipe? CSST product, but that is engineered to significantly decrease the potential for lightning induced damage to fuel gas piping systems. CounterStrike has been designed with a proprietary jacket material in place of the standard yellow jacket. This black jacket has energy dissipating properties that will help protect the TracPipe stainless steel pressure liner as well as other fuel gas system components if the CounterStrike becomes energized due to lightning.
The improved version of CounterStrike is designed to withstand significantly higher levels of lightning energy when compared to first generation CounterStrike and, of course, to conventional TracPipe with the yellow jacket. CounterStrike has been shown to be 50 times more resistant to the damaging effects of electrical energy than conventional TracPipe, and is at least 6 times more resistant to that damage than the previous version of CounterStrike.
No product, including the improved CounterStrike is immune to the damage caused by a direct lightning strike. Refer to NFPA 780 for lightning protection systems for buildings and building systems.
CounterStrike Advantages
There are no additional bonding requirements for CounterStrike imposed by the manufacturer's installation instructions. With CounterStrike's improved properties, CounterStrike is to be bonded in accordance with current requirements of the National Electrical Code (NFPA 70), and the National Fuel Gas Code (NFPA 54), and with any local requirements that may be in excess of the national codes. This may result in the avoidance of additional bonding costs which are required for conventional CSST.
 

Dennis Alwon

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
Here is something for all those local jurisdictions that say a #6 is fine for this bonding. This excerpt also has the methods for bonding.

1. For bonding of the conventional yellowjacketed TracPipe? system, a bonding clamp must be attached to the brass AutoFlare? fitting adapter (adjacent to the pipe thread area ? see Figure 4-21) or to a black pipe component (pipe or fitting) located in the same electrically continuous
gas piping system as the AutoFlare? fitting. The corrugated stainless steel
portion of the gas piping system SHALL NOT be used as the bonding attachment point under any circumstances. The bonding conductor shall be bonded per the National Electrical Code NFPA 70. Bonding electrode conductor sizing shall be in accordance with NFPA 70 Article 250, Section and Table 250.66
 

cpal

Senior Member
Location
MA
You can also attach to the brass connector that fastens the CSST to the black pipe. Make sure you use an approved clamp for brass.

I'm pretty sure that at this time there is not a UL clamp listed to "US standards" allowing attachment to the compression nut on csst brass connetctors.

I know one of the csst mfg shows a clamp connected as such but it mentions only CSA listing.

I am interested if you currently have one that is recognized in US ????
 
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