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Branch circuit lighting

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Jpflex

Electrician big leagues
Location
Victorville
Occupation
Electrician commercial and residential
I am running lighting for an industrial ball mill building. 4,225.03 square feet x 1.7va X1.25 (assuming workshop? Table 220.12)

Based on outside dimensions) lighting and general loads require 8,978 va with at least 4 Of 20 ampere branch circuits.

There will be 8 lights on one circuit paralleled on one switch. Led bulbs only 8.5 watts each or less than 0.56 of an ampere for entire lighting circuit

My question is that if trying to figure optional feeder size such as using #10 AWG THHN with 40 amperes at 90 degrees Celsius

Then, after ampere ampacity correction for temperature and terminating at 60 degrees I would be left with 26.1 amperes available for this conductor. # 10 AWG wire at 60 degree yields 30 amperes. Ambient temperature at 105 degrees for 90 degree wire yields correction reduction of 0.87% further reducing this conductor to 26.1 ampere

This seems fine for feeder I want to bring to junction box but I’m confused if I’ll have to run #10 wire to lights or could I reduce wire at this 4 square metal box to #14 AWG only for the conduit containing lights using less than 1 ampere.

The breaker being used to protect circuit couldn’t be 26.1 because this is not standard so I could go down to 25 amperes if I decide to supply receptacles or go up to 30 amperes for just lighting.

Question if I tap 14 AWG lighting wires to 10 AWG Feeder at box as explained above won’t there be a fire hazard or violation if current exceeds 14 awg wire limit for lights but upstream breaker at feeder is rated for higher 25 or 30 ampere?

If you were to say use 14 awg all the way from Breaker to feeder to lights then how would this meet the requirements of 4 branch circuits based on total general lighting and appliance load from building area in square feet x VA? Thanks
 

augie47

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Tennessee
Occupation
State Electrical Inspector (Retired)
Highlighting on only one aspect of your post..... the conductors must be protected at a current no greater than their ampacity unless they meet one of the exceptions. In the case of lampholders, a #14 could be used on circuit rated less than 40 amps BUT only for a,length of 18" or less.
 

Jpflex

Electrician big leagues
Location
Victorville
Occupation
Electrician commercial and residential
W
Highlighting on only one aspect of your post..... the conductors must be protected at a current no greater than their ampacity unless they meet one of the exceptions. In the case of lampholders, a #14 could be used on circuit rated less than 40 amps BUT only for a,length of 18" or less.
here did you get 18” or less? I know of 10’ or less than 10% of circuit length but not 18” in code?
 

david luchini

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Connecticut
Occupation
Engineer
If you were to say use 14 awg all the way from Breaker to feeder to lights then how would this meet the requirements of 4 branch circuits based on total general lighting and appliance load from building area in square feet x VA? Thanks
4*15A*120V=7200VA

4500sf*1.7VA/sf=7183VA

Four 15A circuits should be sufficient for your 4500sf workshop (Three 20A circuits would also be OK.)
 

wwhitney

Senior Member
Location
Berkeley, CA
Occupation
Retired
Then, after ampere ampacity correction for temperature and terminating at 60 degrees I would be left with 26.1 amperes available for this conductor. # 10 AWG wire at 60 degree yields 30 amperes. Ambient temperature at 105 degrees for 90 degree wire yields correction reduction of 0.87% further reducing this conductor to 26.1 ampere
You get to multiply the 90C rating of #10, 40A, by the temperature correction, 0.87, for an ampacity of 34.8A. If the terminations are 60C, you are still limited to 30A at the terminations. And of course the small conductor rule 240.4(D) would also limit you to 30A OCPD.

Cheers, Wayne
 

Jpflex

Electrician big leagues
Location
Victorville
Occupation
Electrician commercial and residential
Yes I was reading the code book and came across 240.4D which has got me more confused because what is the point of ambient temperature ampacity correction/ reduction or more than 3 current carrying conductor ampacity reduction if this code just tells you to use higher ampacity any way. This makes no sense
 

Jpflex

Electrician big leagues
Location
Victorville
Occupation
Electrician commercial and residential
4*15A*120V=7200VA

4500sf*1.7VA/sf=7183VA

Four 15A circuits should be sufficient for your 4500sf workshop (Three 20A circuits would also be OK.)
But as I read the code book it has been unclear when I should use 180 va per receptacle vs outside dimensions x listed va per occupation type ( which isn’t exactly listed for my commercial “ball mill”)
 

Jpflex

Electrician big leagues
Location
Victorville
Occupation
Electrician commercial and residential
Receptacle? Wasn't your question about lighting circuits?
The nec lust general lighting and receptacle loads together, but beside that receptacles don’t matter at this point since company is not asking for them at this point
 
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