CE

[petersonra]

I have been tasked with looking at what it would take to make control panels according to CE requirements.

I have some vague ideas on it but that is about as far as it goes.

Are there any good resources on this task?

I have looked around on the web and while finding some good stuff, there just is not all that much to find unless I am not looking in the right spot.

For instance today, i spent several hours trying to determine just how one goes about doing the ground bond test specified in the machinery directive in 18.2.2. One would think something this simple would be relatively straightforward, but it seems less so after hunting around on the Internet.

My first thought was a big pot and a 24V supply that I could adjust to get 10A through the bonding conductors. Ohms law and a calculator does the rest.

However, after spending several hours puzzling through EN 60204, I came to the conclusion that I am not even sure what has to be measured, or what the pass/fail point would be. It talks about bonding circuits so presumably one must test every green/yellow wire. But, it does not actually say that.

maybe there is a forum like this one for people who are also CE confused.

 

[rbalex]

Since I don't "do" manufacturing, I can't answer directly, but perhaps our colleague Besoeker could help. In addition eng-tips.com is frequented by a larger spectrum of international engineers than we have here.

 

[PetrosA]

One other thing that might help but isn't really electrically related - I've noticed having a hard time googling certain terms lately (like "Installation tester") because of how customized google is becoming. For that particular search I was getting results for "insulation tester" automatically. The workaround I used was to go directly to google.co.uk and search from there.

Supposedly the internet is world wide, but search results are not

 

[GoldDigger]

One other thing that might help but isn't really electrically related - I've noticed having a hard time googling certain terms lately (like "Installation tester") because of how customized google is becoming. For that particular search I was getting results for "insulation tester" automatically. The workaround I used was to go directly to google.co.uk and search from there.

Supposedly the internet is world wide, but search results are not

You should be able to change/customize your search settings if you log into Google before searching.
If you do not have a Google login, you will have more trouble disabling some of the overly helpful features like error correction and prediction.

And FWIW, "Installation tester" (with or without the quotes) works fine for me, so I suspect that you opted into enhanced searching at some point.

 

[Besoeker]

Everything* I buy here that needs to be CE marked is CE marked.
I checked a few items. Desk phone, multimeter, calculator, mouse, the little portable timer Mrs B uses for cooking times (yes the oven can do that too), camera, calculator, chargers.....
I don't have any of our insulation testers to hand but I'd be astonished if they are not CE marked.

 

[mgookin]

I have been tasked with looking at what it would take to make control panels according to CE requirements.

I have some vague ideas on it but that is about as far as it goes.

Are there any good resources on this task?

I have looked around on the web and while finding some good stuff, there just is not all that much to find unless I am not looking in the right spot.

For instance today, i spent several hours trying to determine just how one goes about doing the ground bond test specified in the machinery directive in 18.2.2. One would think something this simple would be relatively straightforward, but it seems less so after hunting around on the Internet.

My first thought was a big pot and a 24V supply that I could adjust to get 10A through the bonding conductors. Ohms law and a calculator does the rest.

However, after spending several hours puzzling through EN 60204, I came to the conclusion that I am not even sure what has to be measured, or what the pass/fail point would be. It talks about bonding circuits so presumably one must test every green/yellow wire. But, it does not actually say that.

maybe there is a forum like this one for people who are also CE confused.

Are you actually going to have them listed? If so, the testing laboratory should be able to assist you with that. Just ask them for a quote and the quote will tell you what standards you are going to be tested for (because that work is indeed the basis of the quote) and then once you're under contract, you'll have direct access to the engineers doing the testing. Until you're under contract, you will be dealing with a sales person who will be in communication with an engineer who will prescribe the tests to be performed.

 

[petersonra]

Are you actually going to have them listed? If so, the testing laboratory should be able to assist you with that. Just ask them for a quote and the quote will tell you what standards you are going to be tested for (because that work is indeed the basis of the quote) and then once you're under contract, you'll have direct access to the engineers doing the testing. Until you're under contract, you will be dealing with a sales person who will be in communication with an engineer who will prescribe the tests to be performed.

I don't think you can actually "list" them for CE purposes. There are some cases where a 3rd party has to be involved, but it does not appear that is required for run of the mill control panels.

 

[mgookin]

I don't think you can actually "list" them for CE purposes. There are some cases where a 3rd party has to be involved, but it does not appear that is required for run of the mill control panels.

My appologies. I had confused CE with CSA.

 

[ELA]

petersonra,
I worked in a position doing EMC pre-compliance testing for equipment that needed to be CE marked.

The CE mark encompassed both EMC (Electromagnetic Compatibility) and Safety requirements.

We had a team of several people involved. We engaged with ETL to do the final "official" testing and test documentation.
We also worked with what they call " a competent body" in Europe.

We certified both large industrial machines as well as individual electronic assemblies.


It was a lot of work and took a long time and cost a lot of money. It has been several years now and I have forgotten a lot of the details. I mainly remember being happy that I did not have to handle the management/political aspects of the project. I stuck to the technical/testing.

I am no expert on the subject, just wanted to relate some experience in the area.

If I recall correctly you did not "have to" test anything. However if you self certify and get caught with equipment that does not meet the standards there is a large price to pay.

It is most helpful if all the individual electronics in the assembly have already been tested to EMC standards and are documented to have passed. ( or are CE marked themselves). That would give you a high confidence level that you are compliant. If not then EMC/electrical safety testing is highly recommended.