Challenger Panel Advice

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Nobody900

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If I am not supposed to post here, my apologies, and feel free to delete this post. I own a home that was built about 1994 and has two Challenger service panels. The label in the entrance panel is no longer readable. It has a meter fitting in the top left with a long empty box below it closed with a screw on cover. The breaker section is a long, single box on the right with a top hinged cover and a single column of breakers all marked "Challenger" so I assume this is a challenger panel. The sub-panel in the garage is a Challenger SL20(20-40)CCT with mostly Challenger and HB breakers. While trying to learn more about this equipment I found a lot of conflicting information on the Internet (surprise).

Some information states the panels are dangerous and have to be replaced. Some state the panels are a good design, but the breakers frequently fail to trip at rated load and need to be replaced while the panel needs to be inspected for evidence of arcing and overheating. Some state there are no issues with Challenger panels. I purchased the home in 2005 and nothing was noted by the inspection technician I hired. I have had three licensed electricians perform work in the home and no one noted an issue. Yesterday I contacted the last one who worked here and he stated he had no knowledge of issues with Challenger equipment.

Can this forum provide me information on what issues may or may not exist with Challenger equipment of this 1994 vintage? I'm an electrical engineer and savvy enough to not "learn" by working on things that can cause fire or death, so any necessary remediation will be done by a licensed professional. I'm just looking for advice on what courses of action I should be considering. Thanks in advance and I can post pictures if anyone wants then.
 
There are issues with the Challenger breakers. I don't have the specifics right now. I have replaced one panel with burned bus fingers. We have replaced many breakersin some communities with those panels.
 
Challenger was the main line I was installing in the 80's. The old single think "A" breakers definitely had issues at times because the bus connection was exposed to being bent prior to installation. After Westinghouse purchased the line they eliminated all of the original challenger breakers and supplied "Bryant" BR breakers with the Challenger "C" and "A" markings. Eaton Type BR breakers are also marked Type C now.

With full sized breakers I never experienced any more buss failures than any other brand plug in breaker. Actually in my past life when I did service work I say as may QO buss connection failures and an others.

Challenger also owned and sold Zinsco and Stab-Lok (FPE) loadcenters in the mid to late 80's.

Edited to add:
A 1994 Challenger panel would be no more unsafe than installing a current model Eaton BR loadcenter with BR breakers. There have been some non functional design revisions to the loadcenters but the breakers are 100% the same.
 
The reason you see negative postings about Challenger is that Challenger formed as a company from the ashes of several other manufactures, some of which had bad reputations, but some which were fine. The people who started the company thought at the time that they could overcome the bad blood on the Zinsco and FPE product lines, which had a HUGE installed base to take advantage of, by starting anew with manufacturing and quality standards. Turned out that there was too much damage and that failed. So by the time your equipment was made, Challenger had jettisoned those bad lines and focused on what had been the Sylvania breaker and panel lines, which is what you have. There never was anything wrong with those, but the damage to the name had been done to Challenger and they went bankrupt. Then they were bought by Eaton and rolled into the Cutler Hammer products, because the old Sylvania had always been compatible with Westinghouse/Bryant, who Eaton had absorbed a decade earlier (their “BR” product line, BR meaning Bryant). So now the Eaton BR lines are compatible with that later Challenger (Sylvania) breaker line that you have.
 
Jraef said:
The reason you see negative postings about Challenger is that Challenger formed as a company from the ashes of several other manufactures, some of which had bad reputations, but some which were fine. The people who started the company thought at the time that they could overcome the bad blood on the Zinsco and FPE product lines, which had a HUGE installed base to take advantage of, by starting anew with manufacturing and quality standards. Turned out that there was too much damage and that failed. So by the time your equipment was made, Challenger had jettisoned those bad lines and focused on what had been the Sylvania breaker and panel lines, which is what you have. There never was anything wrong with those, but the damage to the name had been done to Challenger and they went bankrupt. Then they were bought by Eaton and rolled into the Cutler Hammer products, because the old Sylvania had always been compatible with Westinghouse/Bryant, who Eaton had absorbed a decade earlier (their “BR” product line, BR meaning Bryant). So now the Eaton BR lines are compatible with that later Challenger (Sylvania) breaker line that you have.
Click to expand...
I had never heard that Challenger filed for bankruptcy. They were purchased by Westinghouse in the late 80's. Then in the mid 90's Eaton purchased the Westinghouse electrical equipment division.

A 1994 Challenger panel is 100% a Bryant panel with Bryant breakers. They are just marked with the Challenger name.

When Westinghouse purchased Challenger one of the manufactureing plants and the original Challenger/Sylvania designed load centers and breakers was purchased by T&B. T&B tried pushing the line into many wholesalers but didn't have much success so they eventually dropped the line.
 
Agree with above -- Challenger had too many different lines and many home inspectors point out CHALLENGER BAD on their reports when they may be an OK variant. My wife's last house had a Challenger panel which had breakers with the contact finger on the side. These sometimes had issues. Even without issues, it was annoying to have to get a left side or right side fingered breaker. If the panel will take BR type breakers (which replace Challenger A and C types), I'd just use those if anything needs to be changed (and you may need to use the twin type -- two breaker handles in a normal 1" thick breaker slot). I have a newer Challenger panel and it only has the BR breakers and has been fine. It a bit short on neutral lug space though.
 
curt swartz said:
Challenger was the main line I was installing in the 80's. The old single think "A" breakers definitely had issues at times because the bus connection was exposed to being bent prior to installation. After Westinghouse purchased the line they eliminated all of the original challenger breakers and supplied "Bryant" BR breakers with the Challenger "C" and "A" markings. Eaton Type BR breakers are also marked Type C now.

With full sized breakers I never experienced any more buss failures than any other brand plug in breaker. Actually in my past life when I did service work I say as may QO buss connection failures and an others.

Challenger also owned and sold Zinsco and Stab-Lok (FPE) loadcenters in the mid to late 80's.

Edited to add:
A 1994 Challenger panel would be no more unsafe than installing a current model Eaton BR loadcenter with BR breakers. There have been some non functional design revisions to the loadcenters but the breakers are 100% the same.
Click to expand...

QO had a time period where they had aluminum bus in certain panels that seemed to be highly prone to failure.

What panels are made today that do have aluminum bus is tin plated and doesn't have this problem, at least not at frequent as those older panels that failed a lot.
 
Thanks a lot to all who took the time to educate an amateur. Your help is much appreciated. I and my wallet will sleep easier now :).
 
Have there been any issues with the 200 amp main breakers? I have a client that has a main breaker going bad and I've been debating on switching out the 200 amp exterior feed-though disconnect or just replacing the main breaker. The problem with replacing the panel is the new panels are not the same height as the old ones and the existing wire may not be long enough for the new panels. Has anyone had any experience on switching out just the main breaker without any issues afterwards?
 
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