Challenger Panel

[Jimmy7]

I have a customer in a single family residence who would like me to add a 20 amp 120 volt circuit to their 200 AMP Main Breaker Challenger Panel. The panel is extremely full, and as a result their is no room on the neutral bar. What is the best way to alleviate this problem? I was wondering if I could add a new ground bar, and run a #6 ground (Or would have to be a #4) between the two bars, and then relocate some of the ground wires over to the new ground bar to create some space. If this is even a possibility, do I have to have a ground bar that is rated for a Challenger Panel? Does anyone make ground bars that are listed for Challenger Panels, or would any ground bar due as long as I drill and tap it?

 

[Ponchik]

I have seen many filled panels that over time with a circuit here and there get filled for no reason.

IMO, go through the circuit directory and see which circuit/s you can add together.

Sometimes you will have unnecessary dedicated circuits. Smoke detectors, one circuit just for the bathroom light, one circuit just for the bedroom....

IMO, you will find such circuits that you can connect together and use one circuit breaker to create your neutral opening.

Can you share your circuit with another circuit?

 

[ptonsparky]

Generally you can double or triple up the wires under a screw if they are EGs, Read the labels. You can also pigtail several of the EGs together.
I've used about any Mfg EG bar as needed. Scrap paint, a jumper to the Neutral bar, about anything.

 

[Jimmy7]

The new circuit is for a second refrigerator, so I'd like to put it on its own breaker.

 

[Little Bill]

Generally you can double or triple up the wires under a screw if they are EGs, Read the labels. You can also pigtail several of the EGs together.
I've used about any Mfg EG bar as needed. Scrap paint, a jumper to the Neutral bar, about anything.

If the bar is only for grounds, there is no need for a jumper to the neutral bar.

 

[jaggedben]

You don't need a Challenger ground bar. But Eaton is the successor to most Challenger panels I've seen, and an Eaton groundbar may be slightly more likely to match up to exisiting mounting holes in the panel.

 

[Ponchik]

The new circuit is for a second refrigerator, so I'd like to put it on its own breaker.

You "want" to or "need" to?

If "want" to, then why? I am curious.

 

[Jimmy7]

I guess I really don't need to have it by itself. I guess was trying to prevent something other than refrigerator possibly tripping the gfci breaker. The refrigerator will be located in the garage.

 

[ptonsparky]

Two ways to look at it.
1. Yours, so that nothing else trips it.
2. Something that you use often indicates that the refrigerator is no longer ON.

 

[James L]

If the bar is only for grounds, there is no need for a jumper to the neutral bar.

I agree here.
I also have a 200 amp Challenger panel in which I'm adding washer and dryer circuits.

I'll be adding a ground bar on each side for grounds only, where I marked in green.
Drill and tap to mount, no jumpers to neutral bar

 

[mopowr steve]

Well that may help you correct the egc’s that look to be landed under the same screw as the neutral conductors.
And you will need a wire to the added ground bars if the bonding screw is not there.

 

[James L]

Well that may help you correct the egc’s that look to be landed under the same screw as the neutral conductors.
And you will need a wire to the added ground bars if the bonding screw is not there.

Yes, I have to add the ground bars to get relief from the existing neutrals and grounds sharing holes

 

[Little Bill]

Well that may help you correct the egc’s that look to be landed under the same screw as the neutral conductors.
And you will need a wire to the added ground bars if the bonding screw is not there.

Unless you're landing grounded conductors on the added ground bar, you won't need any wire/jumper added.

 

[4x4dually]

I guess was trying to prevent something other than refrigerator possibly tripping the gfci breaker.

Bingo.

 

[Rick 0920]

Buy a small ground bar kit and drill and tap to the can. The neutral bar is already bonded to the can. Does Cutler-Hammer make tandem breakers that are listed to use in Challenger panels? That would free up some space for your additional breaker.

 

[ptonsparky]

250.8 (A) Permitted Methods.

You don't need a jumper from Neutral to your added EG terminal bar but if it is not designed particularly for that enclosure, you might want to pay attention to (5) & (6).

Plus 250.12 Clean Surfaces.

The 6" jumper will not hurt anything.

 

[mopowr steve]

You

Unless you're landing grounded conductors on the added ground bar, you won't need any wire/jumper added.

You would if the EGC bars are just floating without connection to the grounded conductor in some fashion. I take it that this is the service panel.

 

[electrofelon]

Easiest thing to do is remove a bunch (or several bunches) of EGCs and pigtail them all together. Of course if every EGC is under the same screw as a neutral, you won't free up any spaces

 

[Little Bill]

You

You would if the EGC bars are just floating without connection to the grounded conductor in some fashion. I take it that this is the service panel.

They wouldn't be floating as they are mounted directly to the can. They don't have to connect to the neutral bar as it should be bonded to the can already.

 

[Strathead]

Buy a small ground bar kit and drill and tap to the can. The neutral bar is already bonded to the can. Does Cutler-Hammer make tandem breakers that are listed to use in Challenger panels? That would free up some space for your additional breaker.

Is the wall of the can really thick enough to get the 250.8(A)(5) two threads engagement?

While it isn't the prettiest thing in the world, the easiest thing to do is remove some ground wires and pigtail them to a single hole freeing up however many the OP needs. This was suggested by an earlier poster.