Charge for the headache ?

[Jerseydaze]

I have a church that wants to replace there existing UG service from 100 a to 200a single phase.

To accomplish this the new service equipment has to go in place of the existing equipment.I have to some how get the electric inspector and PSEG to coordinate to minimize downtime .I will have to meet both electrical inspector and Pseg inspector multiple times at site.How do I bid the job and be fair to myself and the customer ?the headache factor is a little unknown and I can see the Site meeting times adding up.In NJ for what it's worth.

 

[gadfly56]

I have a church that wants to replace there existing UG service from 100 a to 200a single phase.

To accomplish this the new service equipment has to go in place of the existing equipment.I have to some how get the electric inspector and PSEG to coordinate to minimize downtime .I will have to meet both electrical inspector and Pseg inspector multiple times at site.How do I bid the job and be fair to myself and the customer ?the headache factor is a little unknown and I can see the Site meeting times adding up.In NJ for what it's worth.

I'd lay out a schedule on paper, indicating each milestone that would need to be achieved. Fool around with it, see how much you can do in a single visit whether it's with the POCO or inspector. When you have that figured out, start thinking about what can go wrong; what if someone cancels a meeting? Is there paid time involved other than for yourself? If you need a three-way, figure that half of them one of the parties isn't going to show up and you'll need to reschedule. Manage the customer's expectations. You don't have to let them know the gory details, but let them know that your best estimate is "X" site visits (some multiple of what the ideal minimum would be, say 1.3) at "Y" hours, plus the installation itself. The fewer surprises the more understanding the customer will be when the inevitable glitches occur.

 

[mgookin]

Service changes are as common as drinking water to POCO's & inspectors alike.
I'm not understanding what's different about this one.
The coordination for disconnect, inspection & reconnect are typically choreographed to a T.

Am I missing something here?

 

[kwired]

Any competitor wanting to do same project will have similar issues and will charge as they see necessary as well. Unless maybe they have a better relationship with either the AHJ or POCO, but they have somehow acquired that situation and is a factor in all their projects involving same AHJ or POCO.

Unexpected delays from such people can come up and people often eat any loss, but if they know from past that such delays are nearly always expected, they account for them in their cost, and take a bonus on the rare occasion when there is no delay.

You can be a nice guy and offer them a refund or rebate or even just call it a gift to the church if things turn out well in the end and your costs were lower then expected, that is your choice.

 

[cowboyjwc]

Service changes are as common as drinking water to POCO's & inspectors alike.
I'm not understanding what's different about this one.
The coordination for disconnect, inspection & reconnect are typically choreographed to a T.

Am I missing something here?

I was kind of thinking the same thing. As an inspector, I better not have to go out several times for a 100 to 200 panel upgrade.

 

[jumper]

I was kind of thinking the same thing. As an inspector, I better not have to go out several times for a 100 to 200 panel upgrade.

Yeah, irking the inspector is not a great idea when looking for an easy green tag.

 

[Ponchik]

Locally when I do an upgrade with an UG service especially to a higher amps, we have typically 3-4 inspections. So it may be the case for the OP.

Inspection:
1. the POCO inspector to check the depth
2. POCO inspector to check the fill and a conduit mandrel test
3. The city inspector after the new panel is installed to check for rough inspection and allow the power to be turned ON
4. The last inspection is the final with the city inspector.

It is a pain to schedule both inspectors with your time frame and the POCO installation schedule and at the same time don't leave the client without power over night.

 

[mgookin]

Around here it's

POCO disconnects service
EC does all his work & EI shows up and puts on OK To Connect sticker on new meter "pan" as y'all call it (we call them cans).
POCO comes back and turns power on. Everyone goes home.

It's done dozens of times in a week and works very well.

There's only a hot check on new construction, additions, etc. Not on a service change.

 

[growler]

I have a church that wants to replace there existing UG service from 100 a to 200a single phase.

It really depends on what all you are going to have to do to make the up-grade.


How far from meter/disconnect is the panel? How much work can you do before you have the power company disconnect the service? Change out the panel and feeder?

The service lateral, does it belong to the customer or to the POCO and is it conduit or direct burry cable?

I would rather meet with the power company engineer ( inspector ) for free before bidding the job than take a chance on what all I'm going to have to do on the underground ( may not have to do anything ).

 

[cpinetree]

Around here it's

POCO disconnects service
EC does all his work & EI shows up and puts on OK To Connect sticker on new meter "pan" as y'all call it (we call them cans).
POCO comes back and turns power on. Everyone goes home.

It's done dozens of times in a week and works very well.

There's only a hot check on new construction, additions, etc. Not on a service change.

Did two in the past 6 months, Overhead to Underground.
1) Pull permit.
2) Schedule a date with POCO & schedule electrical inspection for the same day.
3) Any time before the date, dig trench and drop pipe in. (be sure to have depth inspection pipes in place)
4) Day of hook up: Disconnect old service, connect pipe to meter can, pull in wire, have inspection on the new work. POCO reconnects.
5) Profit ???

Was looking at another this morning but, POCO will dig the trench, install pipe and wire for $750
This is a known rocky area. No way we will even think about showing up on that job for anything less than $1500.
We will still need to make the connection in the meter can and upgrade the grounding system.

 

[cpinetree]

Side note:
FPL in our area will provide the pipe, 90's, and fittings for residential overhead to underground.
You need to pick it up from their yard and install it in your trench. They then install their wire.
Sometimes we will install our own pipe and at a convenient time pick up theirs to replace our stock.

 

[James L]

Looks as if OP says it's 100amp underground already, and wanting to upgrade to 200amp underground.

And single phase.

I know nothing about NJ, but would wonder if the existing is in conduit or direct burial. Is the underground going to a pole or pedestal? Does that even matter? Also, hard to imagine a newer single phase service to a church unless it used to be a house?

Heck, this might be as simple as changing the meter can and panel. Around here, POCO would probably leave the same feed underground

I would most assuredly call POCO to ask for specs required, meet a planner on site, etc

I moved a residential 100a service a year and a half ago from overhead to underground without calling POCO first. Old hat, no biggie....WRONG

They had recently changed their requirements, and I knew nothing about it. I ran a 2 inch pipe from the meter can under ground all the way over to the pole, only to have them refuse it because now they require a minimum 3 inch pipe. And they no longer allow it to go up the pole. It has to go to a pedestal at least 6 feet away from the pole, and POCO picks the location. Then they pipe down the pole and underground to the pedestal.

No more assumptions from me. I call first..... Every time

 

[kwired]

Also, hard to imagine a newer single phase service to a church unless it used to be a house?

Churches come in many shapes and sizes, as does the electrical needs/demands for each shape and size.

If they have no social hall in same structure and non electric heating with no cooling - the load can be pretty minimal on some.