Combo CO/SD
- Thread starter mtn_elec
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pierre
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Re: Combo CO/SD
A minimum of one CO detector is required on the lowest sleeping level. If you are only installing one CO, it would have to be on that level.
A minimum of one CO detector is required on the lowest sleeping level. If you are only installing one CO, it would have to be on that level.
goldstar
Senior Member
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Re: Combo CO/SD
The CO-2 detector should be located outside the sleeping ares as Pierre mentioned. However, it does not have to be a combination SD/CO-2 unit and interconnected to the smoke detection system. The CO-2 unit can be a plug-in unit. Most of the fire inspectors up here are asking that you install one somewhere on each level. I'm even starting to see them on new home plans.
The CO-2 detector should be located outside the sleeping ares as Pierre mentioned. However, it does not have to be a combination SD/CO-2 unit and interconnected to the smoke detection system. The CO-2 unit can be a plug-in unit. Most of the fire inspectors up here are asking that you install one somewhere on each level. I'm even starting to see them on new home plans.
- Location
- Lockport, IL
- Occupation
- Semi-Retired Electrical Engineer
Re: Combo CO/SD
However, I have seen (but do not own) carbon monoxide (CO) detectors.
The only CO-2 detector I am aware of is a houseplant. They "breath" carbon dioxide, and give out oxygen as a byproduct. So I suspect they would die if there were insufficient CO-2.
However, I have seen (but do not own) carbon monoxide (CO) detectors.
goldstar
Senior Member
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Re: Combo CO/SD
Good point Charlie. I've been calling them CO-2 detectors for years out of habit. I guess it's a bad habit I developed during my days of wiring extinguishing systems.
Good point Charlie. I've been calling them CO-2 detectors for years out of habit. I guess it's a bad habit I developed during my days of wiring extinguishing systems.
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
Re: Combo CO/SD
We always install combination smoke/CO units outside of the bedrooms. This way the HO only has to see one ugly device hanging on the ceiling instead of two. Besides it makes for less labor to rough in only one box and install only one device.
We always install combination smoke/CO units outside of the bedrooms. This way the HO only has to see one ugly device hanging on the ceiling instead of two. Besides it makes for less labor to rough in only one box and install only one device.
JohnE
Senior Member
- Location
- Milford, MA
Re: Combo CO/SD
In MA we are required to use photo smokes within 20' of a kitchen or bathroom in new installations. From what I understand there are no combo smoke/CO detectors available with photoelectric smoke.
In MA we are required to use photo smokes within 20' of a kitchen or bathroom in new installations. From what I understand there are no combo smoke/CO detectors available with photoelectric smoke.
- Location
- Lockport, IL
- Occupation
- Semi-Retired Electrical Engineer
Re: Combo CO/SD
Probably a result of lobbying from the CO detector people who want to sell more of their own stuff.
dnbob
Senior Member
- Location
- Rochester, MN
Re: Combo CO/SD
When we install co detectors in a commercial parking garage, the sensor is mounted between 4'6" & 5'6", so in a house on a 8 - 10' ceiling doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense, unless they require only a few ppm.
Bob
When we install co detectors in a commercial parking garage, the sensor is mounted between 4'6" & 5'6", so in a house on a 8 - 10' ceiling doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense, unless they require only a few ppm.
Bob
electricmanscott
Senior Member
- Location
- Boston, MA
Re: Combo CO/SD
Another thing in MA is the co detector rules are all over the place. A law was recently enacted that will require detectors in all residences but as of yet the actual regulation has not been written. There are requirements in the gas code but trying to get details is not easy.
[ December 25, 2005, 09:55 AM: Message edited by: electricmanscott ]
This is true. However in my own house I have combo ion/co in basement, first floor and second floor right outdside bathrooms and next to the kitchen. No problems at all.
Another thing in MA is the co detector rules are all over the place. A law was recently enacted that will require detectors in all residences but as of yet the actual regulation has not been written. There are requirements in the gas code but trying to get details is not easy.
[ December 25, 2005, 09:55 AM: Message edited by: electricmanscott ]
pierre
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Re: Combo CO/SD
" but trying to get details is not easy."
I have to admit that this is all too true.
We have a situation in NYS with smoke alarms. The Director of Codes Div for the state told us he would send a letter of clarification in 5 days, that was 5 weeks ago, and still no letter.
Believe it or not, a person from the Department of State (NY) called me on friday at 4:30 pm, I was very surprised to get a phone call at that time, especially so close to Christmas.
They called me to answer my email, saying the law department is having difficulties with the wording of this letter.
While I was on the phone, I asked this person to help me find some other info on the State website... it took an effort from both of us of about 45 minutes, and then neither of us were exactly sure of what was meant, as the term "ADDITION" is not defined, and from the text of the code requirement, we need a definition. The result of the phone call is ... we both walked away not understanding anymore, laughing and wishing each other a Merry Christmas. Maybe next year this will be resolved, as the State does not move at hyperspeed.
" but trying to get details is not easy."
I have to admit that this is all too true.
We have a situation in NYS with smoke alarms. The Director of Codes Div for the state told us he would send a letter of clarification in 5 days, that was 5 weeks ago, and still no letter.
Believe it or not, a person from the Department of State (NY) called me on friday at 4:30 pm, I was very surprised to get a phone call at that time, especially so close to Christmas.
They called me to answer my email, saying the law department is having difficulties with the wording of this letter.
While I was on the phone, I asked this person to help me find some other info on the State website... it took an effort from both of us of about 45 minutes, and then neither of us were exactly sure of what was meant, as the term "ADDITION" is not defined, and from the text of the code requirement, we need a definition. The result of the phone call is ... we both walked away not understanding anymore, laughing and wishing each other a Merry Christmas. Maybe next year this will be resolved, as the State does not move at hyperspeed.
JohnE
Senior Member
- Location
- Milford, MA
Re: Combo CO/SD
MA has 2 "sets" of requirements for CO detectors. One is 527 CMR 31.00 from the Board of Fire Prevention and Regulation. The other regulation is in the Massachusetts Uniform State Plumbing Code 248 CMR 10.00.
527 CMR 31.00 was recently revised and sent out to building officials. As of 12/22/05 it basically says that in residential application with building permits obtained on or after 3/31/06 multiple station hardwired or wireless system detectors shall be on each level and within 10' of bedrooms. Existing dwellings must have detectors in place in the same locations as of 3/31/06, but they are allowed to be battery powered, and not necessarily interconnected.
That is how I'm reading the new regulation, but I have not read it thoroughly, but I will.
The plumbing code only addresses new installations of sidewall vented appliances. It basically says that if there is a sidewall vented gas appliance, then you must have a CO detector on the level of the appliance and outside of each sleeping room. It does not say they must be interconnected, but they must be powered by 120V. This has been very confusing as the plumbing code was amended in July to be effective in august. It was poorly written, and contradicted other codes so it was then rewritten at least one other time.
I have a copy of 527 CMR 31.00 and can e-mail it to anyone in MA who might want it. I'd have to fax the plumbing code amendments. PM me if you're interested.
MA has 2 "sets" of requirements for CO detectors. One is 527 CMR 31.00 from the Board of Fire Prevention and Regulation. The other regulation is in the Massachusetts Uniform State Plumbing Code 248 CMR 10.00.
527 CMR 31.00 was recently revised and sent out to building officials. As of 12/22/05 it basically says that in residential application with building permits obtained on or after 3/31/06 multiple station hardwired or wireless system detectors shall be on each level and within 10' of bedrooms. Existing dwellings must have detectors in place in the same locations as of 3/31/06, but they are allowed to be battery powered, and not necessarily interconnected.
That is how I'm reading the new regulation, but I have not read it thoroughly, but I will.
The plumbing code only addresses new installations of sidewall vented appliances. It basically says that if there is a sidewall vented gas appliance, then you must have a CO detector on the level of the appliance and outside of each sleeping room. It does not say they must be interconnected, but they must be powered by 120V. This has been very confusing as the plumbing code was amended in July to be effective in august. It was poorly written, and contradicted other codes so it was then rewritten at least one other time.
I have a copy of 527 CMR 31.00 and can e-mail it to anyone in MA who might want it. I'd have to fax the plumbing code amendments. PM me if you're interested.
JohnE
Senior Member
- Location
- Milford, MA
Re: Combo CO/SD
In MA you would in install it in family room or anywhere else as long as there are no bedrooms on that level.
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