Commercial kitchen gfi

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Dmc16

Member
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Sparta,nj,United states
I have a request to install a 3 phase 220 volt robot coupe (giant blender basically) in a commercial kitchen. Just confirming I understand the code correct. 150 volts to ground or less, 100 amps or less shall have gfci protection.
which would mean class a gfi since it will trip at lower leakage levels.

Even though said appliance has a twist lock, which would allow that appliance to be plugged in only to the receptacle, it is not so much what is plugged in but protecting personnel using the appliance.

Minor concern of nuisance trips with a three phase gfi bolt on breaker, unless you guys have different suggestions to protect the appliance.

thanks for the help
 
synchro

synchro

Senior Member
Location
Chicago, IL
Occupation
EE
ptonsparky said:
I think your biggest hurdle will be finding a breaker. GFCI protection for a High Leg Delta is almost non existent.
Click to expand...

Since the high leg phase is 208V to ground, wouldn't that mean that GFCI would not be required since it's above the 150V threshold specified in the code?
 
M

MAC702

Senior Member
Location
Clark County, NV
Dmc16 said:
...Even though said appliance has a twist lock, which would allow that appliance to be plugged in only to the receptacle...
Click to expand...

This is a factory-installed cord? Is the twist-lock plug molded on? If not, would you be allowed to remove the plug and hardwire the otherwise factory cord into a disco if it wasn't, or is that a listing violation?
 
infinity

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
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Journeyman Electrician
synchro said:
Since the high leg phase is 208V to ground, wouldn't that mean that GFCI would not be required since it's above the 150V threshold specified in the code?
Click to expand...

Good question since it's both over 150 volts to ground on the high leg and under 150 volts to ground on the other two legs.
 
ptonsparky

ptonsparky

Tom
Location
NE (9.06 miles @5.9 Degrees from Winged Horses)
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EC - retired
synchro said:
Since the high leg phase is 208V to ground, wouldn't that mean that GFCI would not be required since it's above the 150V threshold specified in the code?
Click to expand...

We had this discussion a few months back and some said ‘good luck with that argument’. I’m with the crowd that agrees with you, but that counts for naught. The local AHJ will need to step up.
 
kwired

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Dmc16 said:
I have a request to install a 3 phase 220 volt robot coupe (giant blender basically) in a commercial kitchen. Just confirming I understand the code correct. 150 volts to ground or less, 100 amps or less shall have gfci protection.
which would mean class a gfi since it will trip at lower leakage levels.

Even though said appliance has a twist lock, which would allow that appliance to be plugged in only to the receptacle, it is not so much what is plugged in but protecting personnel using the appliance.

Minor concern of nuisance trips with a three phase gfi bolt on breaker, unless you guys have different suggestions to protect the appliance.

thanks for the help
Click to expand...

My biggest justification for the need for GFCI's (outside of art 680 applications) is the potential loss of the EGC to the equipment in question. In past most the rules made sense. 5-15 and 5-20 cord caps are most likely cord cap out there to see a missing EGC pin. If you can assure the EGC is very unlikely to be compromised (even hardwire can be compromised but is much more rare than cord and plug connection) GFCI wasn't seen as all that necessary and certainly not enough to justify requiring the use of GFCI.

Now the CMP's have decided that we need to expand to all sorts of things, not because the risk of shock is greater but so far only justification I have seen in any reports by CMP is basically to the effect: because we now have the ability to do so. Seems to me this is likely manufacturer driven sort of like many think the AFCI's were. And guess what, mostly same manufacturers in both cases.

Sure the manufacturers are not the CMP, but they have people either on CMP's or at very least working to convince the CMP's that it is necessary.
 
D

Dmc16

Member
Location
Sparta,nj,United states
Thanks for the links. Once I get into the install I think I will go gfi, just for safeties sake. The hardwire option will be plan “b” if needed.

My my apologies I stated 220, because I was looking at the nameplate on device while posting. The voltage is 120/208 so no high leg. I do have to call manufacture to confirm it will operate on 208 just to be thorough. I’m inclined to say it will because it shows two amperage ratings on it.
 
R

ramsy

Roger Ruhle dba NoFixNoPay
Location
LA basin, CA
Occupation
Service Electrician 2020 NEC
Inspector might want to see that GFCI disconnect within sight of the equipment
 
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