Conduit cubic fill.

[11bgrunt]

Recently I started a thread about moving the RF meter from the house to the POCO service pole.
Four 4/0 al conductors for source and load are under the 40% fill for 2". I would add a 2/0 Al for the grounded conductor only because of the wire available. This conductor takes the fill over 40%.
Should it even count since it will stop at the new meter socket and there will be no panel below the meter?
Thanks.

 

[ActionDave]

I'm confused. Four 4/0 and a #2 for what? You would only need four conductors total.

 

[Little Bill]

I'm confused. Four 4/0 and a #2 for what? You would only need four conductors total.

I'm thinking he meant two load and two line 4/0 since he said "source and load". But I'm not understanding what he's doing anyway.:happyno:

 

[GoldDigger]

I think he is looking at keeping the existing POCO overhead to the house, so at the intermediate pole the wires will go from one dead end span down the pole to the meter and then up to a second dead end span to the house
So all four wires would be in one POCO conduit down the pole. And NEC would not apply, FWIW.

 

[iwire]

So all four wires would be in one POCO conduit down the pole. And NEC would not apply, FWIW.

It depends on the local power company, some places that conduit and pipe are customer owned and controlled or sometimes like you say sometimes POCO controled.

 

[iwire]

Four 4/0 al conductors for source and load are under the 40% fill for 2". I would add a 2/0 Al for the grounded conductor only because of the wire available. This conductor takes the fill over 40%.
Should it even count since it will stop at the new meter socket and there will be no panel below the meter?
Thanks.

If they are in the same pipe they all count.


However it sounds like you want to put four hots and one neutral in the conduit.

That is at least four current carrying conductors and means you have to derate the wire.

Run a line and load pipe, put three conductors in each.

 

[GoldDigger]

Just a reminder that although there is a line and a load side of the meter both are still service conductors.

 

[iwire]

Just a reminder that although there is a line and a load side of the meter both are still service conductors.

Very likely so but does that change anything?

 

[kwired]

Here is where the term "service point" makes a difference.

If service point is at the house or even up to the load side connection of the weatherhead above the meter, this raceway is outside the scope of NEC.

That meter and raceway may be owned or paid for by the HO, but may be specified/controlled/maintained by the POCO and per the NEC is essentially POCO equipment

If you have line and load conductors in one raceway dropping to the meter, there is no neutral load to supply there, but you still need a grounded conductor run down there and bonded to the meter can. You only need one grounded conductor, and it would be sized per 250.102. Would only need to be 4 AWG copper or 2 AWG aluminum for OP's case. Would need to increase if the ungrounded conductors need increased to more then 250MCM for adjustments though.

Did not do the math, but 250's and use of XHHW compact conductors along with a bare 4 AWG copper may still fit in 2 inch.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Very likely so but does that change anything?

It does around here. The utility does not permit metered and unmetered service conductors in the same raceway.

 

[GoldDigger]

It does around here. The utility does not permit metered and unmetered service conductors in the same raceway.

Not even if it is "their" raceway?
They certainly allow them in the same enclosure (the meter socket/base.)

 

[kwired]

It does around here. The utility does not permit metered and unmetered service conductors in the same raceway.

Is not a NEC violation though.

5 wire drops to metering equipment/site isolation device (installed by POCO) is very common on farms in these parts when there is overhead distribution on the site.

 

[Carultch]

Recently I started a thread about moving the RF meter from the house to the POCO service pole.
Four 4/0 al conductors for source and load are under the 40% fill for 2". I would add a 2/0 Al for the grounded conductor only because of the wire available. This conductor takes the fill over 40%.
Should it even count since it will stop at the new meter socket and there will be no panel below the meter?
Thanks.

If you try to exceed the NEC percentage requirements on conduit fill, with any complexity to the path, that wire is not going to make it through. Even those requirements are tighter than you'd really want to build, in a practical sense.

 

[GoldDigger]

If you try to exceed the NEC percentage requirements on conduit fill, with any complexity to the path, that wire is not going to make it through. Even those requirements are tighter than you'd really want to build, in a practical sense.

On the other hand, if it is going to work anywhere a 10' straight section of pipe open on end is where it would work. No complexity there.

 

[mivey]

If you try to exceed the NEC percentage requirements on conduit fill, with any complexity to the path, that wire is not going to make it through. Even those requirements are tighter than you'd really want to build, in a practical sense.

Path complexity aside, utilities use a higher fill percentage than the NEC all the time. Different set of rules.

 

[kwired]

Path complexity aside, utilities use a higher fill percentage than the NEC all the time. Different set of rules.

They also commonly pull multiplexed conductor assemblies which act more like a single conductor when being pulled. NEC even has greater fill capacity for single conductor then multiple conductors but doesn't really mention these multiplexed assemblies.