conduit vs romex

Status
Not open for further replies.

bob awerkamp

New member
If romex is alowed in residential, and conduit is required in comercial, what about multipurpose buildings such as comercial below and residential above?
Does the NEC allow romex to be used for wiring the second floor apartments?
In our small town the local code guy does not know the answer.
:confused:
 
bob awerkamp said:
If romex is alowed in residential, and conduit is required in comercial, what about multipurpose buildings such as comercial below and residential above?
Excluding any local codes and speaking only of the NEC, romex is allowed in commercial buildings and conduit is allowed in residential

bob awerkamp said:
Does the NEC allow romex to be used for wiring the second floor apartments?
You need to read article 334.

You can View the NEC online by clicking HERE

Roger
 
Bob,
a real plus to answering your question would be for us to know where you are located and , if you know, what code cycle is being used in that local.

So, where ya from? :D
 
bob awerkamp said:
If romex is alowed in residential, and conduit is required in comercial, what about multipurpose buildings such as comercial below and residential above?
Does the NEC allow romex to be used for wiring the second floor apartments?
In our small town the local code guy does not know the answer.
:confused:

Common misconceptions about both when it comes right to the NEC - you're local codes may vary.... You should check with your AHJ - They may have ammendments that supercede the state or NEC.

Example:
334.10. Revise this section as follows:
334.10. Uses permitted. Type NM, Type NMC, and Type NMS cables shall be permitted to be used in the following:
(1) One- and two-family dwellings,
(2) Multi-family dwellings permitted to be of Types III, IV, and V construction up to 4 stories in height except as prohibited by 334.12.
334.12(11). Add a new section as follows:
334.12(11).
(11) In any nonresidential structure or occupancy.

Other examples I have seen are through other codes that change building type for certain building use, and require non-combustable wiring methods to be used in them. i.e. metallic. Simularly require raceway methods, and ban PVC.

'what about multipurpose buildings such as commercial below and residential above?'

I have done some buildings that have the whole first floor commercial zoned as part of the mixed use and they get all metallic conduit and MC. Like-wise all of the stud work is tin... Then there is a concrete deck, and the next 3 floors except for common areas, and FA - get romex. And the framing is wood.... Simularly, I have done first floor commercial, and the next 10 floors in MC and pipe because other local codes and building spec's change the building type often triggered by building hieght, and other codes dictated what was or could be installed.

IMO you should first check your adopted NEC (Code cycle?), then state for changes, and when-ever you even go to bid a project in a new town - go find out what they will or will not allow through other ammended codes before you sumbit the bid. 'Cause I know a few places you can get screwed in just by not bidding apples to apples - only to find out you just got the big bannana. A town to the south of me only allows metallic raceway methods in residential..... :rolleyes: My city wount allow flex longer than 6' - but that town you could run it by the thousand's, but no cable of any kind - each place has it's quirks. :mad: Even the way certain codes are interpeted regionally can mean things won't be done the same.
 
roger said:
Excluding any local codes and speaking only of the NEC, romex is allowed in commercial buildings and conduit is allowed in residential

You need to read article 334.

You can View the NEC online by clicking HERE

Roger
Be very careful here and especially read 334.12 "Uses Not Permitted". For example: 334.12(1) Not allowed "as open runs in dropped or suspended ceilings in other than one- and two-family and multifamily dwellings.". This was added to the NEC in 2002.
 
your best bet is to check with local building inspector.
Mixed use buildings are tricky and all depends to local builing codes and AHJ.
Here in California we wired them with MC Cables.No NM allowed.
 
We use the most unsafe (nm) in places we have kids sleeping and conduit in commercial where nobody is in serious danger like small stores with likely less than 10 people at any given time.Forget logic and think $$$$$$$$$$$
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
We use the most unsafe (nm) in places we have kids sleeping and conduit in commercial where nobody is in serious danger like small stores with likely less than 10 people at any given time.Forget logic and think $$$$$$$$$$$


Jim how do you feel NM is unsafe if installed correctly? Just out of curiosity?
 
stickboy1375 said:
Jim how do you feel NM is unsafe if installed correctly? Just out of curiosity?

It has always been the easiest to damage and if for what ever reason overloaded what is safer.Given the choice at same price would you pick nm over conduit ?
 
stickboy1375 said:
Jim how do you feel NM is unsafe if installed correctly? Just out of curiosity?

I second this question, how about some statistics Jim?

Roger
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
It has always been the easiest to damage and if for what ever reason overloaded what is safer.Given the choice at same price would you pick nm over conduit ?

Yes I would... A screw will go through emt just like romex, besides, most other trades will just pre-drill if they hit resistance anyways...
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
It has always been the easiest to damage and if for what ever reason overloaded.

I don't get how NM can be overloaded easier than any other wiring method with proper OCPD's.


Jim W in Tampa said:
Given the choice at same price would you pick nm over conduit ?

It depends. If the NM was easier and faster to install, the I would chose that over pipe.
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
Given the choice at same price would you pick nm over conduit ?

If I was doing the installation in my own home I would go with NM. (BTW, this actually the case in my home, I could have used conduit but didn't)

Roger
 
peter d said:
I don't get how NM can be overloaded easier than any other wiring method with proper OCPD's.




It depends. If the NM was easier and faster to install, the I would chose that over pipe.

It has always been easier and faster and cheaper.Like i said if overloaded (forget why) and it starts to burn i would like the added protection.Its simply far more costly in time and material and unafordable.Yes a drywall screw can and will go thru it but should that result in a hot spot the flame likely is within the pipe.If its not safer just why are we using it ?
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
It has always been easier and faster and cheaper.Like i said if overloaded (forget why) and it starts to burn i would like the added protection.Its simply far more costly in time and material and unafordable.Yes a drywall screw can and will go thru it but should that result in a hot spot the flame likely is within the pipe.If its not safer just why are we using it ?

Jim, just move to Chicago and be done with it already. :D
 
I just went to a seminar where the figures from a NFPA and NFIRS study showed that between 1995 and 2000, electrical distribution fires as a % of total residential fires stats. The nation averaged around 10%, Chicago which only allows conduit averaged around 4%.
Electrical distribution included all fixed wiring, from the service to the branch circuit wiring.
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
If its not safer just why are we using it ?

Well with no statistics to go by the answer will be, "it's not a safer wiring method, it's just an old wives tail".

Roger
 
russ said:
I just went to a seminar where the figures from a NFPA and NFIRS study showed that between 1995 and 2000, electrical distribution fires as a % of total residential fires stats. The nation averaged around 10%, Chicago which only allows conduit averaged around 4%.
Electrical distribution included all fixed wiring, from the service to the branch circuit wiring.

Russ, can you provide the study information to substantiate this claim?

Roger
 
russ said:
The nation averaged around 10%, Chicago which only allows conduit averaged around 4%.
Electrical distribution included all fixed wiring, from the service to the branch circuit wiring.

Call me a skeptic, but I highly doubt that 10% of fires are caused by premises wiring.
 
peter d said:
Call me a skeptic, but I highly doubt that 10% of fires are caused by premises wiring.

Are you saying more than 10% of fires are caused by premises wiring?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top