Contractor Clarification Form..

[Emanon]

Does any one have a form that a contractor can fill out stating what items are included in the structure prior to me estimating a set of drawings. I usually ask about tub motors, etc. when estimating and over the past few houses [new contractors due to the economy] I have been told no or did not recieve an answer. Now that the project is underway one is being installed and a change order was put in. I am being told I should have accounted for one since it is a larger home [3800sq'] and supposedly this is what the sq' guys do; along with not charging for door jamb switches if the framing requires a change from the standard switch shown on the wall.

We usually itemize quite a bit and the sq' thing doesn't seem to be working very well. We even had one competitors proposal including ceiling fans and structured wirring in the base price [I saw his actual numbers and had to let that job go, no way I could compete with that] below 14,000 for a 3500sq' home on the ocean.

It may just be the builders are taking advantage of the new guy, but It still sounds like a good thing to have on hand.

Thanks in advance,

 

[barbeer]

this is what the sq' guys do;

the sq' thing doesn't seem to be working very well.

Who or what are they/it?:smile: (sq')

 

[ceb58]

If the contractor is building a spec. house they can tell you what is going in it. A custom home is a different animal. I price them by the plans but include wording in the contract that it is priced per the plans given and any additions will be done on change order. I make it a point to go through the home with the owners checking every thing on the plans before I start and I let them know that it is cheaper to add something now than later after drywall or what ever is in place. The only bad thing is right now with every thing the way it is the contractors have an advantage. If this contractor is keeping you in work you may want to eat the price of the tub and get him on the next one.

 

[CopperTone]

If this contractor is keeping you in work you may want to eat the price of the tub and get him on the next one.

I wouldn't eat anything - get paid for what you do. the GC is trying to screw you. is this the only thing on this job he wants for free?

Put it this way -

option 1 - if you charge him now for the extra and he doesn't like it but pays and doesn't use you next time - you got paid for the extra.

option 2 - If you don't charge him now and you try to make it up later and that makes your price too high and he goes with the next sucker - you don't get paid for that last extra.

with both options you are not doing anymore work for the guy but with option 1 you have a few hundred more.
the reality is with option 2 - you probably have already eaten a bunch of things so you will naturally include those for your next bid and if you try to make up some money from the last freebies your price could be much higher and put you out of the running for the next job.

If the homeowner asked to enclose the deck halfway through the project and told the GC that the other bids he had included that. Do you think the GC would say - oh ok then I'll get right on that - no charge. - no way

So, why should you work for free? This is part of the problem with our industry - guys are afraid and GC's are not and know that.

 

[cadpoint]

My first thought is that your not a Ft Sq Man...

Then, I thought it was called an "RFI", IE a request for information.

It's business and your sounds complex and Other!

Between the two responses, I agree, but the volume of your work, how does that fit into a Square price. What happens when they go Green and want to go LV lighting or some outside service or, and, and/or, and just add some plus, plus, plus...

No its a fair request, charge for anything other and well otherwise , Work fast!? ...

 

[aline]

Does any one have a form that a contractor can fill out stating what items are included in the structure prior to me estimating a set of drawings. I usually ask about tub motors, etc. when estimating and over the past few houses [new contractors due to the economy] I have been told no or did not recieve an answer. Now that the project is underway one is being installed and a change order was put in. I am being told I should have accounted for one since it is a larger home [3800sq'] and supposedly this is what the sq' guys do; along with not charging for door jamb switches if the framing requires a change from the standard switch shown on the wall.

We usually itemize quite a bit and the sq' thing doesn't seem to be working very well. We even had one competitors proposal including ceiling fans and structured wirring in the base price [I saw his actual numbers and had to let that job go, no way I could compete with that] below 14,000 for a 3500sq' home on the ocean.

It may just be the builders are taking advantage of the new guy, but It still sounds like a good thing to have on hand.

Thanks in advance,

Good estimating software may be what you're looking for.

I have both of the estimating software in the below links. TurboBid & Vision.

My version of Vision is an old version I've had for years so I don't know what the newer version is like.

TurboBid allows you to generate a quantity take off per room report to send with your proposal so there is no question as to what is included.

http://www.turbobid.net/TurboBidHome.html

http://visioninfosoft.com/

 

[Emanon]

The only bad thing is right now with every thing the way it is the contractors have an advantage. If this contractor is keeping you in work you may want to eat the price of the tub and get him on the next one.

That seems to be the way it is.

I am not a sq' guy and usually it works fine by having everything itemized and spelled out; with a little allowance for the little additions that invaribly come up. The hot tub is a specific instance on one of my last few projects. It is in a custom built house which is why it not being marked on the plans and not clearly responded to in previous conversations has gotten a response out of me when it came up as a change order.

Aline. I usually estimate pretty much by itemization; a program would not have helped me in these past few situations since my competition has been [and is] bidding everything by the sq'. Only because of the times am I in this situation. And now I know WHY I do not like Sq' bidding. Though I have toyed with the idea of Turbobid. I may when times are better and have a little more time for a learning curve.

Does any one have an "RFI" form that could be used with a home builder covering the major items? I can make one but was hoping to save some time with all the experience here on the forumn.

 

[growler]

Does any one have an "RFI" form that could be used with a home builder covering the major items? I can make one but was hoping to save some time with all the experience here on the forumn.

I do exactly what you do when estimating a custom house. If I don't see it on the plans I make a note of it and call the homeowner or builder. Either they say it's included in the estimate or it's not. That's how a clearly defined scope of work it put togather.

All the things that they declined to include in the estimate are listed in red and a note that they are not included. All items not included will be billed as and extra if added later.

Either you have a scope of work ( itemized list ) or you are back to square ft. pricing. There really is no middle ground.