Copper Greenfield.

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tkb said:
The cable looks like Vitalink 2hr rated cable.
http://www.r-scc.com/vitalink-fire-safety

Single conductor cable needs to be terminated on a nonferrous plate or a slot needs to be cut between the knock outs.
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Yep, looks like single conductor Vitalink to me too. And as others said, if this is an AC circuit it is a violation and will have overheating issues.
 
K8MHZ said:
Yes, and now it's slang for FMC. Art. 348. The picture is of MC cable, Art. 330, and was errantly referred to as 'Greenfield'. IIRC, Greenfield was the name of the company that invented FMC.
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Thank you for that. It's what we would have called Kopex.
 
So it says they have stainless steel connectors for that application. Their manual also states about induction.
461765d74ce7359550c1b690d8f27a95.jpg


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texie said:
Yep, looks like single conductor Vitalink to me too. And as others said, if this is an AC circuit it is a violation and will have overheating issues.
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While not code compliant, unless the conductors are operating with current exceeding 300-400 amps, there probably is not a real world overheating issue.
 
Since the cables are two hour rated, does the junction box need to be two hour rated too?

What would the rating of a standard junction box with a screw cover and no knock outs have?
 
tkb said:
Since the cables are two hour rated, does the junction box need to be two hour rated too?

What would the rating of a standard junction box with a screw cover and no knock outs have?
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Well I suppose the j-box might be outside the rated area. But yes, if it was in the protected area that would not fly. They make rated splices for this.
What many miss with Vitalink and similar products is the fact that not only must the product be listed to UL category FHIT, but the entire installation must be done per FHIT and the related system number assigned to the product. It gets very detailed right down to the straps, etc.
 
K8MHZ said:
Nope. 53% fill means you could almost get two conductors in there. This installation looks like 80% fill, to me.

I don't know what size the conductors are, but I would also make sure the box is big enough.

What will happen to the box when the slots are cut? Do I see concentric knock outs? That won't be fun to deal with, and how well are the fittings going to fit after slotting? I would also see if the fittings are listed to be used with knock outs with slots. I wouldn't if I were an NRTL.
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Though I believe what we have here is single conductor cables, a 1 inch diameter circle has ~.785 square inches. 53% of that is ~.416 square inches - which is a ~.728 inch diameter circle - no way you will be close to putting two .728 diameter circular items inside a 1 inch diameter circle. Think about why two conductor max fill is only 31%, has to do with how well diameter of a circle(s) fits inside another circle more so then the total area it takes up.
 
don_resqcapt19 said:
While not code compliant, unless the conductors are operating with current exceeding 300-400 amps, there probably is not a real world overheating issue.
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From 2005, comments on Canadian Electrical Code:

The Canadian Electrical Code recognizes this problem and provides several possible solutions to avoid sheath currents and their associated problems. Rule 4-008 specifies the following for single-conductor metal-sheathed or armoured cables when electrical loads exceed 425 amperes:

Derating the single-conductor cables to 70 percent of the minimum conductor ampacities permitted in Tables 1 or 3; or

With an inspector’s permission, derating the cables according to the cable manufacturer’s recommendation; or

Isolating the metallic sheath or armour from ground at one end of the cable by entering electrical equipment through a non-metallic plate with separate bonding added to re-establish electrical continuity between equipment
 
texie said:
Well I suppose the j-box might be outside the rated area. But yes, if it was in the protected area that would not fly. They make rated splices for this.
What many miss with Vitalink and similar products is the fact that not only must the product be listed to UL category FHIT, but the entire installation must be done per FHIT and the related system number assigned to the product. It gets very detailed right down to the straps, etc.
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You are correct.

NEC Article 728 Addresses fire resistive cabling systems. Here are a couple of relevant sections.

728.4 General. Fire-resistive cables, fire-resistive conductors,
and components shall be tested and listed as a complete
system, shall be designated for use in a specific fire-rated
system, and shall not be interchangeable between systems.
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728.5 Installations.
(E) Boxes. Boxes or enclosures used as part of a fire-resistive
system shall be listed as part of the fire-resistive system and shall
be secured to the building structure independently of the raceways
or cables listed in the system.
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In addition, the Guide information for FHIT says in Part,

Ratings apply only to the entire system assembly, constructed using the combination of components and materials specified in the individual system. Components and materials are designated for use in a specific individual system for which corresponding ratings have been developed, and are not intended to be interchanged between systems. Ratings are not assigned to individual system components or materials.
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There are 26 systems that are Certified (Listed) under the Product Category FHIT.

Chris
 
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