Counterfeit supplies

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kbsparky

Senior Member
Location
Delmarva, USA
Just when you thought it was safe to go out, along comes another counterfeit product on the market with fake UL labels on them:

Ground Rods!

No joke, now the hacks have even gone as low as selling fake ground rods ...:mad:

What will they try to scam us on next :-?
 

mdshunk

Senior Member
Location
Right here.
Does a fake ground rod do the job any less well than one with a legitimate UL mark? It's not exactly a high-tech piece of hardware. I've been purchasing and installing ground rods for at least two years that I know have no UL mark on the rod or the bundle tag.
 

480sparky

Senior Member
Location
Iowegia
kbsparky said:
No joke, now the hacks have even gone as low as selling fake ground rods ...:mad:
What will they try to scam us on next :-?

Maybe they're using all the copper they stole from the job site! :wink:
 

kbsparky

Senior Member
Location
Delmarva, USA
...I've been purchasing and installing ground rods for at least two years that I know have no UL mark on the rod or the bundle tag....
Exactly my point. I just bought a couple dozen rods, and never have I seen any UL marking on them. These were galvanized rods, so I don't know if that makes any difference or not.

I wonder if the "fakes" would sell just as well marketed plain, without any label or listing on `em :-?
 

almcvay

Member
The code book states that you can use a 10 ft. pipe as a ground rod. It has no lable on it for grounding. Does a ground rod need a UL Lable?
 

roger

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Fl
Occupation
Electrician
I would like to know what tests are performed on ground rods for them to get a listing. :rolleyes:

Roger
 
A standard was developed for ground rods a few years back. So, some companies started to manufacturer ground rods to the standard, hence listed ground rods.
The NEC does not require ground rods that are installed to be listed. There was an add, which I still see once in a while that had a "ground rod card tester" to test for the proper size ground rod (most listed copper clad ground rods are a little bigger in diameter). Some of the inspectors here were going around testing ground rods with those clever little cards...go figure, I guess you call that good marketing.
 

LawnGuyLandSparky

Senior Member
This is clearly a case where money interests (UL) and actual safety clash. What is wrong with the "bad" ground rods? No randsom paid to UL is the high crime here.

UL's "press release" is written like the public water supply is contaminated with anthrax. Since UL has become a household name, it seems to be cashing in on the unknowing public assuming it's approval is synonymous with "safe" to the degree that anything not-UL listed must equal unsafe.

And I think it's disgusting. And sad.
 

jim dungar

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Wisconsin
Occupation
Retired Electrical Engineer - Power Systems
Part of the problem is that the ground rods in question infer that they are UL listed when they are not.

Even though it appears UL is infering the rods are unsafe, they do have the right to protect their identity. And if the local codes require products to be listed, people need to be aware that these rods aren't.
 

George Stolz

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
Occupation
Service Manager
This is one of those items it's so stupid it's funny. :D

What you should do: If you suspect a counterfeit ground rod was installed on your premises, contact a qualified electrician and have it replaced with a UL-Listed ground rod.
I like how they conveniently leave out "or install an unlisted rod at least 5/8" in diameter." :D :D

If you have in your possession a ground rod bearing a counterfeit UL Mark that has not been installed, UL recommends that the counterfeit ground rod be returned to the place of purchase.
I can already see the class action lawsuit against UL by all the homeowners tweaking their backs pulling ground rods out to return them. :D

250.52(A)(5)(b) Electrodes of rods of iron or steel shall be at least 15.87 mm (58 in.) in diameter. Stainless steel rods less than 16 mm (58 in.) in diameter, nonferrous rods, or their equivalent shall be listed and shall not be less than 13 mm (12 in.) in diameter.

So, in looking at this section again, I wonder: Do all copper-clad ground rods require listing? Honest question.
 

dellsworth

New member
Location
Oklahoma
Flattened copper tubing in place of a fuse

Flattened copper tubing in place of a fuse

Where is it written that one cannot use copper tubing flattened on both ends in a fusable disconnect switch in order to make it a non-fusable disconnecting means?
 

brian john

Senior Member
Location
Leesburg, VA
Who needs copper?

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EMTFUSES.jpg
 

charlie b

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Seattle, WA
Occupation
Electrical Engineer
dellsworth said:
Where is it written that one cannot use copper tubing flattened on both ends in a fusable disconnect switch in order to make it a non-fusable disconnecting means?
How about 110.3(B)?
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
dellsworth said:
Where is it written that one cannot use copper tubing flattened on both ends in a fusable disconnect switch in order to make it a non-fusable disconnecting means?

Perhaps 110.3(B).

They do make fuse shaped not a fuse gizmos to keep us out of the plumbing scraps. :cool:
 
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