Cover for Comm conduits

[iggy2]

Article 800 cables, installed in a chapter 3 wiring method (PVC conduit) - raceways must be installed to comply with Chapter 3. If cables are buried, in PVC conduit, under a "street, highway, road, alley, driveway or parking lot", 24" cover is required per table 300.5, 5th row down.

1) If 24" cover cannot be had, can 2" of concrete be added over the top, and the raceway - which is still under a "street, highway, road, alley, driveway or parking lot", - be installed per row 2 of the table? (I do not see that row 2 can apply to a situation which is under a "street, highway, road, alley, driveway or parking lot"... only the 5th row addresses that situation. In other words, you do not get to pick which row you want to use. You pick the row that applies to your situation. Conversely, I do not then know how to install a conduit under a paved, vehicular area with less than 24" cover.)

2) If yes to 1 above, would the paving (assuming it's is at least 2" thick, binder and finish, constitute the "2" thick concrete or equivalent"?

Thanks.

 

[petersonra]

 

[xformer]

..... WOW.... Someone just got Code-slapped.

 

[iggy2]

From the Mike Holt website:

Raceways

[800.48] Raceways are optional for communications circuits. You can install communications cables in any of the Chapter 3 raceways, if you do so per the appropriate article for a given raceway. Exception: Conduit fill restrictions do not apply to communications cables and conductors installed in a raceway.

(see https://www.mikeholt.com/mojonewsarchive/NEC-HTML/HTML/Article800CommunicationsCircuits~20030109.htm)

 

[iggy2]

....and, take the comm cable element out of the question. Question still applies - can we select whatever row of table 300.5 that we want? Or just the one that fits.

 

[kwired]

Some places don't really enforce chapter 8 either. May not amend it out, just don't pay particular attention to it. They still would reject you running chapter 8 wiring within same raceways, enclosures etc. without providing barriers as power and lighting equipment though, or even reject hanging chapter 8 cables from power/lighting raceways/cables at least if not associated with equipment served.

 

[kwired]

....and, take the comm cable element out of the question. Question still applies - can we select whatever row of table 300.5 that we want? Or just the one that fits.

quite often more than one fits, you can select any of the ones that do fit.

Worst case "all other installations" always fits.

 

[petersonra]

From the Mike Holt website:

Raceways

[800.48] Raceways are optional for communications circuits. You can install communications cables in any of the Chapter 3 raceways, if you do so per the appropriate article for a given raceway. Exception: Conduit fill restrictions do not apply to communications cables and conductors installed in a raceway.

(see https://www.mikeholt.com/mojonewsarchive/NEC-HTML/HTML/Article800CommunicationsCircuits~20030109.htm)

IMO, unless there is a specific requirement in chapter 8 requiring it, nothing in chapters 1-7 applies to chapter 8. because that is what the code says.

In any case, even if this quote from a Mike Holt publication is correct, the cover requirements are not found in the article for that type of raceway raceway. They are in a separate article.

 

[iggy2]

There is no "all other installations" - I believe you are referring to "All locations not specified below" (emphasis added). So I at least, cannot use that first row for a vehicular area since vehicular areas are specified below. To restate the question differently, can I ignore that the conduits are under a vehicular area if I put 2" of concrete over them?

 

[kwired]

There is no "all other installations" - I believe you are referring to "All locations not specified below" (emphasis added). So I at least, cannot use that first row for a vehicular area since vehicular areas are specified below. To restate the question differently, can I ignore that the conduits are under a vehicular area if I put 2" of concrete over them?

Sorry, didn't look to see actual wording and realized was probably not 100% how it was worded. Maybe should at least not have used the quotation marks?

 

[iggy2]

the cover requirements are not found in the article for that type of raceway raceway. They are in a separate article.

Good point. But if I look at Art 352, para 352.10(G) refers to 300.5, which incorporates table 300.5. So while the cover requirements are not stated in 352, they are by reference.

 

[petersonra]

Can you dig a trench under the road surface?

 

[iggy2]

Sorry,

Apology NEVER required.

 

[petersonra]

Good point. But if I look at Art 352, para 352.10(G) refers to 300.5, which incorporates table 300.5. So while the cover requirements are not stated in 352, they are by reference.

I have not been able to find anything in chapter 8 that says you have to abide by chapter 3. But I did not look real hard.

 

[iggy2]

Can you dig a trench under the road surface?

Yes - that is the intent. And the question - can I use either row 2 (above) or row 5? I see this as something different folks/AHJs could interpret either way.

 

[iggy2]

I have not been able to find anything in chapter 8 that says you have to abide by chapter 3.

Me either - I am strictly going by MH's article. (Reference to 800.48 is probably out of date. I wish things were dated. I went back to 2011 code, and 800.48 does not address this - will keep going back to see if I can find an applicable reference - maybe it has been deleted. But questions still applies for power conduits...)

 

[kwired]

Can you dig a trench under the road surface?

View attachment 2559471

You can before the roadway is constructed over it later, you can also cut out part of roadway, trench in whatever, fill it then repair/replace what was cut out of roadway.

Directional boring under the road may be a different animal? It's not a trench.

 

[petersonra]

Yes - that is the intent. And the question - can I use either row 2 (above) or row 5? I see this as something different folks/AHJs could interpret either way.

Are you sure that these are even chapter 8 applications? a lot of people want to shoehorn ethernet cables into chapter 8 when they are properly class 2 circuits, thus article 725.

The vast majority of actual article 800 applications would be wiring installed by a utility such as a cable company or telephone company inside a premises, or maybe wiring extended from where the utility stopped its wiring to the communications equipment itself.