chevyx92
Senior Member
- Location
- VA BCH, VA
Does a permanently installed decorative fountain installed in a building still need a bonding grid regardless of whether it has electrical or not?
Decorative Fountains...
- Thread starter chevyx92
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Logan, Utah
Take a look at Part V of Article 680.
Chris
Chris
chevyx92
Senior Member
- Location
- VA BCH, VA
I did earlier, and didnt think they needed one, but just wanted a second opinion.
- Location
- Logan, Utah
Correct, 680.50 says that Part I and Part V of Article 680 apply to fountains. 680.26 is located in Part II and is not referenced by Part V so therefore it is not required.
Chris
- Location
- Simi Valley, CA
I would agree with Chris, again.
Kind of getting to be a bad habit.:grin:
Kind of getting to be a bad habit.:grin:
chevyx92
Senior Member
- Location
- VA BCH, VA
Now let me throw this twist in it. If someone were to use this "Fountain" to baptize people and it had electrical, would it need a bonding grid????
Cavie
Senior Member
- Location
- SW Florida
Chris has been studying up on pools.
- Location
- Logan, Utah
If you are baptizing someone then it would be a pool and not a fountain.
The definition of pool includes "immersion" specifally for this reason.
By the way, the addition of the term "immersion" was new to the 2008 NEC.
Chris
- Location
- Logan, Utah
chevyx92
Senior Member
- Location
- VA BCH, VA
I have a customer who has this fountain that has been pour in the new church. We took the job over from an EC that started it. There is no bonding grid for this "Fountain". I recently found out their intentions were to baptize people in the fountain. I mentioned they needed a bonding grid and explained it to the customer. I explained the possibilities and liabilities if not itstalled correctly and said the inspector wont pass it. Their response was we aren't telling the city what it will be used for.
This is a church remind you.
- Location
- Logan, Utah
I have a customer who has this fountain that has been pour in the new church. We took the job over from an EC that started it. There is no bonding grid for this "Fountain". I recently found out their intentions were to baptize people in the fountain. I mentioned they needed a bonding grid and explained it to the customer. I explained the possibilities and liabilities if not itstalled correctly and said the inspector wont pass it. Their response was we aren't telling the city what it will be used for.
That won't do them much good if someone is electrocuted while being baptized.
Chris
I have a customer who has this fountain that has been pour in the new church. We took the job over from an EC that started it. There is no bonding grid for this "Fountain". I recently found out their intentions were to baptize people in the fountain. I mentioned they needed a bonding grid and explained it to the customer. I explained the possibilities and liabilities if not itstalled correctly and said the inspector wont pass it. Their response was we aren't telling the city what it will be used for.
I wonder why the other EC walked away from the project. :grin:
chevyx92
Senior Member
- Location
- VA BCH, VA
No, and neither would it in a swimming pool. All I was saying is that it should have one if that was their intentions.
- Location
- Logan, Utah
I agree, if their intentions are to use this as a pool it should be done so up front.
Chris
chevyx92
Senior Member
- Location
- VA BCH, VA
I can't force anyone to do the right thing. All they have to say is that it is a fountain and thats it. Whatever they change their mind to later is out of everyones control. I can only inform and advise the correct methods. And no I wouldn't be dragged into court. I wouldn't have liability.
- Location
- Massachusetts
If some dies in that pool from electrocution and you did wiring in the building you will be at the least investigated and have to give depositions. Count on it.
- Location
- Logan, Utah
Agreed,
The fact that they are going to lie to the AHJ about the intent of the "fountain" and you are aware of it will not look good in court.
Chris
RICK NAPIER
Senior Member
- Location
- New Jersey
If you have a good rapport with the AHJ tell him quietly on the side and let him ask the questions and deal with it. I have done this often and appreciate the assistance of the electrical contractor and keep their involvement out of the discussion.
- Status