Dog pound GFCI?

[peter d]

Just completed a job today at a town garage. Reason being OSHA paid a visit and made a list. Most things made sense (exit signs out, cord caps with ground pins cut off, etc)

They asked that all the receptacles in the dog pound section of the garage be changed to GFCIs.

2 questions:

Is this in the NEC? I don't have my book with me.

Can OSHA ask for things to be brought up to modern codes? This particular town garage was built in 1988.

[ July 28, 2005, 05:19 PM: Message edited by: peter d ]

 

[peter d]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Forgot to mention that dog pounds really stink!!

 

[benaround]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

peter d,

Maybe you could change the c.b. to gfci instead of the recpts., If it smells that bad!!
I think even in 1988 that recpts. below 18" in classified location to be gfci,but that's just out of memory.

frank

 

[ryan_618]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

If this falls within the scope of a commercial garage, you would have to comply with 511.12, but I have a strange feeling that it doesn't.

 

[peter d]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Originally posted by benaround:
peter d,

Maybe you could change the c.b. to gfci instead of the recpts., If it smells that bad!!
I think even in 1988 that recpts. below 18" in classified location to be gfci,but that's just out of memory.

frank

It would have been nice to use a GFCI breaker, but one slight problem: The panel is an FPE. Not the cheap stab lock but a bolt on kind. Same cheap looking breakers though.

A dog pound is a classified location? Because of the methane content?

 

[peter d]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Originally posted by ryan_618:
If this falls within the scope of a commercial garage, you would have to comply with 511.12, but I have a strange feeling that it doesn't.

The dog pound was completely separated from the garage portion of the building, so I don't see how that could apply.


On another note, the other guy I was working with caused a short and guess what? The FPE breaker actually tripped!!

 

[hardworkingstiff]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Originally posted by peter d:
It would have been nice to use a GFCI breaker, but one slight problem: The panel is an FPE. Not the cheap stab lock but a bolt on kind.

Can you get a GFCI receptacle in the circuit before it leaves the panel area?

 

[peter d]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Originally posted by hardworkingstiff:
Can you get a GFCI receptacle in the circuit before it leaves the panel area?

The job's allready done. I had to put a GFCI receptacle in each location. The walls of the pound were concrete block with a single conduit coming into each box. They all joined up in the ceiling in a j-box. So I couldn't even use the load side feature. Oh well....thank you OSHA. :roll:

 

[bphgravity]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

I believe OSHA might consider receptacles that will be used by workers to perform maintenance or other operations with portable tools and equipment as a temporary electrical power and thus require the gfci protection. Similar to the requirements in Article 590.

 

[georgeswe]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Just to put in a word, I have shot myself in the foot a few times thinking I would remedy the problem by throwing in a GFCI only to have my Electrician remind me that we have Multi-wire circuits and that it will be a pain to pull a Ded. neutral thru the existing conduits


"but it looked Sooooooooooo good on paper......."

I relaize that this was a Residential application so you probabbly had Romex and it wouldnt apply to you.

 

[iwire]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Originally posted by georgeswe:
Just to put in a word, I have shot myself in the foot a few times thinking I would remedy the problem by throwing in a GFCI only to have my Electrician remind me that we have Multi-wire circuits and that it will be a pain to pull a Ded. neutral thru the existing conduits

GFCI receptacles will work fine on multiwire branch circuits.

 

[peter d]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Originally posted by iwire:
GFCI receptacles will work fine on multiwire branch circuits.

So will a 2-pole GFCI circuit breaker.

 

[georgeswe]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Sorry was talking about just throwing in a GFCI breaker.

 

[redfish]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

They asked that all the receptacles in the dog pound section of the garage be changed to GFCIs.

Maybe they are worried that a dog might pee on the receptacle.

 

[steve66]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

An FPE panel in a dog pound?

For the animal's sake, I hope the building is sprinklered and has a fire alarm. I hope the same thing for the cities sake. The backlash from a fire could be pretty severe.

You should let someone know what kind of reputation these panels have.

 

[luke warmwater]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

I bid a dog kennel once.

All of the receptacles in the kennel areas were spec'd GFCI. I asked the owner about it, and he said they wash down the walls and floors.

Seemed like a good idea.

 

[steve66]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

The general rule in dog pounds is that everything will get peed on.

And the reception desk just inside the front door is the #1 target

 

[peter d]

Re: Dog pound GFCI?

Originally posted by steve66:
An FPE panel in a dog pound?

For the animal's sake, I hope the building is sprinklered and has a fire alarm. I hope the same thing for the cities sake. The backlash from a fire could be pretty severe.

You should let someone know what kind of reputation these panels have.

Not just for the dog pound, but for the entire public works complex including the pound, the town garage and DPW office, and all the fuel dispensing equipment.

It does have a fire alarm, but it's an old one from 1991. No sprinklers.

There's not a chance that the town will pay for a new service. These are big bolt on panels we are talking about here. As I said earlier, my coworker caused a short and the breaker did indeed trip almost immediately, surprisingly enough. So perhaps the quality of FPE wasn't so bad in the late 80s.