Double-tap meter base or feed-through panel?

[TimWA]

Hi all,
Have a customer with a new property who wants a 200A service installed on the well house with panel inside, to run the water, trailer recep, and constuction power. No probs.

Question is, when it comes time to use the same service to power the house after it is built. Can the meter-base load-side lugs be tapped again, eg. with those vinyl-covered triple-tap Polaris splices?

Or should I use a 200A-rated feed-through panel in the well house now and plan on going that way later to power the house?

Or some additional dedicated tap enclosure for both (ugly) ?

 

[jrannis]

The feed through panel sounds like a perfect solution. Do you see a down side to using one?

 

[TimWA]

Not sure. How big does the panel have to be to feed through 200A? Ie. does this solution mandate an oversized panel in the well house, only 60A required there.

 

[Cow]

I agree with the feed-thru panel idea. It'd work great for what your describing.

The only other way I could think of doing it would be to use a 320 amp meterbase with factory 2 hole lugs. Use one set for the well house and the other for the home. But if your inspector doesn't allow you to run directly from the meterbase to the home without setting a disconnect first, you might as well of spent your money on the feed-thru panel and a regular 200 amp meterbase.

 

[hurk27]

I have done many by using a 200 or 320 meter base, and installing double barrel lugs, this way the conductors to the house are still service entrance and only require 3 conductors, and since your not entering the well house you don't need a disconnect.

From the load side of the meter one set of service entrance conductors run into the main breaker panel in the well house and is wired as a service, the other set is ran out of the meter into the ground over to the house and is treated just like a service without a meter on the building, hitting a main breaker panel or disconnect, grounding and bonding is done just like a service.

200 amp meter bases that will accept double barrel lugs are not common but I think Mil bank has them.

 

[TimWA]

That's great, thanks so much. I'm going to research that & call my inspector to see if he will go for it.

 

[LarryFine]

I have done many by using a 200 or 320 meter base, and installing double barrel lugs, this way the conductors to the house are still service entrance and only require 3 conductors, and since your not entering the well house you don't need a disconnect.

Exactamundo! This is the least expensive and easiest way to do it.

 

[hurk27]

Just explain to him that code only requires protection and disconnect where the SEC's enter a building or structure, and since the meter is just a wide point in the service entrance conductors, then the conductors you run back into the ground from the meter are also.

you might also talk to your POCO and let them know you will need access to the meter in the future to add the house SEC's.

I used to get a lot of mixed responses when a inspector See's it done this way, but when I explain the above they have always said ok.

The nice thing is, you have to install a grounding electrode anyways under 225, and a disconnect/main breaker, so this way its no different from a service, just no meter on the house, I do this the other way too, with the meter at the house feeding both an out building and the house.

and 230.40 Exception 3 is what allows this.

Oh if he tries to hit you with 230.71 (grouping of disconnects) this is only for each building, not separate buildings

 

[TimWA]

Right on Wayne, I think you are dead right with that, allowing 3 SEC's to the house instead of four, should be no disconnect required as you observe, no different from remote meter on the street in effect. "Wide point"- I like that.

I'll call my AHJ to see if there are unanticipated concerns but really can't see where. You have built a compelling case!

Then I'll track down a double-load-lug meter base with my local suppliers or specify off the internet.

I like this elegant solution, prob good for many one-service-two-building scenarios. Much appreciated.
-TimWA

 

[kbsparky]

For something as simple as a pump house, many of you are suggesting overkill.

On such a job, I would use a meter/main box on the outside of the pump house. It has 8 breaker spaces for circuits for the pump house, and 200 Amp feed-thru lugs for the 200 Amp lines for the dwelling.

All in one box. No double lugs, or oversized equipment needed:

All for less than $200. Typical box is Square D a Homeline RC816F200CH.
Type QO available as well: QC816F200CH at higher cost.

 

[TimWA]

This actually was my electrical supplier's take on it also, to use a mobile pak (Meter-main). One advantage I see (besides cost) is it places the well-house breaker action on the building exterior, preserving useful indoor space.

 

[TimWA]

Some further thoughts on this. I realize I did not mention a vital element in this scenario- requirement for back-up power via generator. In contemplating, I realized that both the feed-thru panel solution or double tap meter for house/well-house, both easy at the outset, would be a nightmare for powering via a seperately derived system.

The solution as I see it now is initially to power an interior well house panel via simple back-to-back 200A meterbase.

When the main house is built, disconnect the well-house panel from the meter base entirely and serve the main house instead.

In the same trench, run a feeder back from the main house to the well-house panel which now becomes a regular downstream subpanel of the utility-fed main house.

Only now I can power everything selectively, including critical well pump, via generator back-feeding the main house panel (with interlock of course)

Whew!

Any holes in this notion?

 

[hurk27]

yea that kind of throws a wrench into the works:grin:

set a 200 amp meter base to a 200 amp disconnect that will feed a automatic transfer switch with double lugs on the load side, feed 4-wire to house from one set, and feed a main lug in the well house, of course a disconnect will have to be installed at the house, but you still won't need OCP at the house for the panel.

Mil-Banks does make a meter combo that has a 200 amp disconnect built in it, but its pricey, the above will be a little cheaper. but price it both ways.

 

[kbsparky]

If you are considering a manual transfer setup, you can still use the meter/main panel with an interlock kit. Install a twist-lock flanged inlet right into the side of the panel, with a w/p plate on it.


For automatic transfer switch installation, you'll spend lots more $$$, however.

 

[TimWA]

Yes manual transfer only.

kbsparky, sounds like you are referring to something like this:
http://www.milbankmfg.com/Products/Catalogs/CatalogFiles/PDF/5168.pdf

with optional interlock & Nema3R twist-lock inlet box (to backfeed breaker) installed directly in the side of the panel?