I have a situation where an new electrical contractor to our site ran conduit across at a 45 degree angle from one side of the open (cubicle) area to the other side. In our site, all existing conduit where possible runs parrallel or at 90 degrees to a wall. I been trying to find something in the code to help me determine if I can tell them to change it. We have workmanship issues already with this contractor, would this be workmanship issue?
electrical contractor workmanship
- Thread starter oscarito
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Bremerton, Washington
- Occupation
- Master Electrician
Re: electrical contractor workmanship
Maybe. It would be hard to prove. NEMA has a standard on workmanship, but you would have to reference it in your specifications.
Maybe. It would be hard to prove. NEMA has a standard on workmanship, but you would have to reference it in your specifications.
Re: electrical contractor workmanship
Maybe this contractor is a genius who understands the principles of wire pulling. This sounds as if he is running from home plate directly instead of via first base. This saves material - and more importantly - eliminates one [unnecessary] 90? bend.
However, sometimes it is important to co-exist with the other trades and do the orthogonal thing. It all depends on how crowded it is up there.
What other "workmanship" issues do you have with this contractor?
~Peter
Maybe this contractor is a genius who understands the principles of wire pulling. This sounds as if he is running from home plate directly instead of via first base. This saves material - and more importantly - eliminates one [unnecessary] 90? bend.
However, sometimes it is important to co-exist with the other trades and do the orthogonal thing. It all depends on how crowded it is up there.
What other "workmanship" issues do you have with this contractor?
~Peter
hurk27
Senior Member
- Location
- Portage, Indiana NEC: 2008
Re: electrical contractor workmanship
If this will be covered up by wall board, I can't see an issue. But if it will be exposed then I could understand the cosmetic's of having a conduit running across the rafters as it would stick out like a sore thumb. but this is not an NEC issue but is up to the person paying the bill and to whether or not he will be doing the work for you again. I would explain that you would prefer that the conduit when exposed to be ran with the structure members and not at angles.
We even do this on rope jobs. and when we run across the garage we try to keep the conduit or romex on the back side away from the garage door so it's not so visible from the driveway. but again that's a personal preference not a NEC requirement
If this will be covered up by wall board, I can't see an issue. But if it will be exposed then I could understand the cosmetic's of having a conduit running across the rafters as it would stick out like a sore thumb. but this is not an NEC issue but is up to the person paying the bill and to whether or not he will be doing the work for you again. I would explain that you would prefer that the conduit when exposed to be ran with the structure members and not at angles.
We even do this on rope jobs. and when we run across the garage we try to keep the conduit or romex on the back side away from the garage door so it's not so visible from the driveway. but again that's a personal preference not a NEC requirement
Re: electrical contractor workmanship
A little insight: We have an agreement with the city that we do our own electrical inspections. Having said that: during a walk thru the inspector brought the issue to light.
Other workmanship issues: conduits on the wall with couplings, curved power poles, disconnects mounted on mechanical units and blocking access panels and so on... We have warned them about lockout/tagout procedures. No, they're not coming back to our site...
The conduit is above a hung ceiling but every conduit is neatly located around the space or run along the joists but not these guys.
A little insight: We have an agreement with the city that we do our own electrical inspections. Having said that: during a walk thru the inspector brought the issue to light.
Other workmanship issues: conduits on the wall with couplings, curved power poles, disconnects mounted on mechanical units and blocking access panels and so on... We have warned them about lockout/tagout procedures. No, they're not coming back to our site...
The conduit is above a hung ceiling but every conduit is neatly located around the space or run along the joists but not these guys.
Re: electrical contractor workmanship
Generally Speaking I See The Requirement For Running Perpendicular And Parallel To Walls In The Specifications On Commercial Projects. But The 2002 NEC 110.12 Just Calls For It To Be Installed In A Neat And Workmanlike Manner.
-Ed
Generally Speaking I See The Requirement For Running Perpendicular And Parallel To Walls In The Specifications On Commercial Projects. But The 2002 NEC 110.12 Just Calls For It To Be Installed In A Neat And Workmanlike Manner.
-Ed
G
Guest
Guest
Re: electrical contractor workmanship
Suggestion: Give the contractor a sketch or working drawing of what you expect. If s/he has any issues with your plan s/he will bring them to your attention. In a sense you did not have any idea what you wanted, but once it was done you did not like it. If you want to enforce the rules you have to let the players in on your rules. Better to avoid problems up front. Have a plan. Without a plan you are both to blame.
Suggestion: Give the contractor a sketch or working drawing of what you expect. If s/he has any issues with your plan s/he will bring them to your attention. In a sense you did not have any idea what you wanted, but once it was done you did not like it. If you want to enforce the rules you have to let the players in on your rules. Better to avoid problems up front. Have a plan. Without a plan you are both to blame.
B
bthielen
Guest
Re: electrical contractor workmanship
I think that both parties are equally responsible.
When I hire a professional for a project I am not necessarily hiring the project because I'm too lazy to do it myself. I am hiring the project because I may not feel qualified or may not have the time so I am hiring the professional for his/her professionalism. I expect the professional to use his/her experience and training to do the job right the first time.
At the same time, the professional does need adequate information in order to accurately perform the task to the satisfaction of his/her customer. I also expect the professional to ask very pointed questions so we can try to cover as many bases as possible. This is where experience really pays off. A professional has been around the block and should be able to lead his/her customer toward good choices.
What is cosmetically pleasing to one is not always the same for all. If the buyer is not taking an active interest and monitoring the progress, then it is not fair to complain about cosmetics after the fact. I think workmanship will speak for itself over time. A contractor that displays poor workmanship will likely find it increasingly difficult to sell his/her service.
Bob
I think that both parties are equally responsible.
When I hire a professional for a project I am not necessarily hiring the project because I'm too lazy to do it myself. I am hiring the project because I may not feel qualified or may not have the time so I am hiring the professional for his/her professionalism. I expect the professional to use his/her experience and training to do the job right the first time.
At the same time, the professional does need adequate information in order to accurately perform the task to the satisfaction of his/her customer. I also expect the professional to ask very pointed questions so we can try to cover as many bases as possible. This is where experience really pays off. A professional has been around the block and should be able to lead his/her customer toward good choices.
What is cosmetically pleasing to one is not always the same for all. If the buyer is not taking an active interest and monitoring the progress, then it is not fair to complain about cosmetics after the fact. I think workmanship will speak for itself over time. A contractor that displays poor workmanship will likely find it increasingly difficult to sell his/her service.
Bob
hbiss
EC, Westchester, New York NEC: 2014
- Location
- Hawthorne, New York NEC: 2014
- Occupation
- EC
Re: electrical contractor workmanship
With all due respect it sounds like you are being picky. Most of these "problems" don't sound like "workmanship" issues but rather a difference of opinion on how things should be done.
We have an agreement with the city that we do our own electrical inspections. Having said that: during a walk thru the inspector brought the issue to light.
Who does the inspections? An outside agency or someone from your company? If it's the latter I can see a conflict of interest and possibly a lack of knowledge.
The solution is to tell the contractor what you want from the get go as well as watching what is going on along the way, not complaining after the fact. If you are just going to hire a contractor and assume that he shares your asthetic values you are going to be dissappointed.
With all due respect it sounds like you are being picky. Most of these "problems" don't sound like "workmanship" issues but rather a difference of opinion on how things should be done.
We have an agreement with the city that we do our own electrical inspections. Having said that: during a walk thru the inspector brought the issue to light.
Who does the inspections? An outside agency or someone from your company? If it's the latter I can see a conflict of interest and possibly a lack of knowledge.
The solution is to tell the contractor what you want from the get go as well as watching what is going on along the way, not complaining after the fact. If you are just going to hire a contractor and assume that he shares your asthetic values you are going to be dissappointed.
j_braddock
Member
Re: electrical contractor workmanship
you stated that your existing wiring is run parallel to the framework. this is your standard and his wiring does not meet it. its nit picky i know, but it is your plant standard.
you stated that your existing wiring is run parallel to the framework. this is your standard and his wiring does not meet it. its nit picky i know, but it is your plant standard.
- Status