Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

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Matt Chance

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We manufacture and install a demountable interior partition system (Superwall / Raco). Our Market has been in the Carolinas for approximately the last 25 years and have had no issues. We have expanded into the Virginia Market and have run into the following issue and need some advice. Briefly, the wall system is installed complete and then the rough in occurs after the installation. Typically a "renovation box" or "cut in box" is used to facilitate rough in and it attaches to rigid conduit or flex that is brought into the stud cavity from the top of the wall. The issue we have is the inspections department claims that the box has to be secured within 12" of the box per the NEC. The problem is that this can't be done because the wall system is complete prior to the rough in. What i am looking for is a name of someone to talk to, a testing agency or any other resource that could help. What i think i need is an engineering judgement from someone with national jurisdiction that will generate a written waiver. Please forward any ideas you might have. Thank you!
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

I think you may have meant to say that the inspector wants the cable secured 12" from the box.There are exceptions for cables that are fished into finished walls. I am not sure what kind of cable you are using or where the walls are being installed.If nm cable is permitted in your installation look at NEC section 334.30(1)or for type mc cable look at 330.30(1)

There may be other requirements if there are metal studs in the walls.

Also there may be some local rules that prohibit the exceptions. romeo
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

What type of rennovation or cut-in box is not secured in place??

Per 314.23(C)- Mounting in finished surfaces - An enclosure mounted in a finished surface shall be rigidly secured thereto by clamps, anchors, or fittings identified for the application.

Handbook comentary: Where structrual members are lacking, or where boxes are cut into existing walls, boxes are permitted to be secured by clamps or anchors. (It shows an example of a box with an integral bracket that snaps in behind the drywall to hold the box into place.

Steve
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

Matt, are You referring to some type of curtain wall? Tried to find specs. Romeo has it on securing within 12" of a box, etc. and Steve has it on "Cut ins"
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

What i think i need is an engineering judgement from someone with national jurisdiction that will generate a written waiver.
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That's really not how the system works. The National Elecrical Code (NEC) is written by the National Fire Protection Agency (NFPA). The NEC only becomes a requirement when government agencies adopt it into law (they may also change or modify parts).

There are probably three ways to get around the requirements in the NEC. But, there is no single person with "national jurisdiction" that has the ability to write a waver. Here are your three options:

1) Submit a proposal to the NEC to have there requirements modified in the next NEC. The modification would apply to all demountable wall's. There is no chance of getting "Manufacturer X is exempt from Y." in the NEC. It has to be an equal playing field.

2) The local inspections department may give you a written waiver, if they feel this won't comprimise safety. Most probably won't be willing to do this, and you would have to take it to each inspections dept. where you want to sell this.

3) Get the local inspections dept. to adopt the NEC without, or with a change to, the part that you don't like. Again, you will have to fight this through each government agency that applies.

Just to reiterate, my earlier post, I think you can probably find a cut-in box that is self securing.

Steve
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

The problem may be that some jurisdictions require new work to have the box supported by a structural member, as this is not an existing installation. You may need to prewire the modular wall system, and then connect it to the premises wiring. Just guessing...
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

Matt, do you have a link to your web site and maybe a picture..
I am confused about the cubicle walls, if that is what you are refering to, that go in before the real walls are roughed in. seems this would make drywall and painting a problem.

I suppose I am misunderstanding the process that you are trying to discribe.
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

Originally posted by pierre:
The problem may be that some jurisdictions require new work to have the box supported by a structural member, as this is not an existing installation. You may need to prewire the modular wall system, and then connect it to the premises wiring. Just guessing...
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BINGO PIERRE! Nice Guess! :D

Welcome to the Commonwealth of Virginia, Matt. :cool:

For those wondering, I believe he is referring to the interlocking partitions, similar to those Bob Vila sponsors on the Sears commercials of "Finishing your basement can be a snap"(He then clicks his fingers and the basement is finished).

It is considered new construction.

If you prewire it as a modular system though, please provide all necessary certifications to the inspector at the time of inspection or have them readily accessible on site in plain view. Please keep in mind that the field installation of the wiring system is not considered modular.

[ January 30, 2006, 05:25 PM: Message edited by: throttlebody ]
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

Bingo throttebody and also pierre I stand corrected and agree. This system seems to be designed to encourage owner wiring I congratulate those that make an effort to stop it .

romeo
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

Another kicker here is that "cut in" boxes can not be supported by clamps or such in rated walls, (if that might be the case at times) they must be fastened to the studs or structure. (UL requirement)

Roger
 
Re: Electrical rough in in demountable partitions

Seems like the OP didnt come back. Some people come here to ask questions who want honest answers. Others seem to come here to get you to back up their point of view. When the users here dont back up the OP point, they get mad.
 
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