Elevator

[ADub]

I had an elevator inspector fail a job today because I ran the machine room light/recep circuit through the controller and cab light disconnect. Space is tight in this closet and i thought I was all in the clear since everything was 600 volt rated and this is pretty common in the industrial world. Well he cited 430.10 as his reference, I pointed him to 312.8 which I feel is more applicable. At that point he took an attitude and said he didn't care what the book said. I can't find any reference of 430.10 in article 620 so I thought it would default back to chapter 3 and wiring methods. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, I just want to know if his citing of 430.10 was accurate. Thanks

 

[GoldDigger]

Well, the elevator controller is also a motor controller, so the 430.10 restriction would seem to apply.
Note that some high numbered sections specifically state that earlier chapters do not apply, apply in part, or apply only where specifically referenced in the later article.
I do not see any such provision in 620, although there are a couple of references back to specific sections.
I would say that he has a righteous cite.

 

[iwire]

My experience is that you will not win this.

 

[ceb58]

I had an elevator inspector fail a job today because I ran the machine room light/recep circuit through the controller and cab light disconnect. Space is tight in this closet and i thought I was all in the clear since everything was 600 volt rated and this is pretty common in the industrial world. Well he cited 430.10 as his reference, I pointed him to 312.8 which I feel is more applicable. At that point he took an attitude and said he didn't care what the book said. I can't find any reference of 430.10 in article 620 so I thought it would default back to chapter 3 and wiring methods. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, I just want to know if his citing of 430.10 was accurate. Thanks

I would say he is correct. Look at the scope of both articles.

312.1 Scope.
This article covers the installation and construction
specifications of cabinets, cutout boxes, and meter
socket enclosures.

430.1 Scope. This article covers motors, motor branch-circuit


and feeder conductors and their protection, motor overload

protection, motor control circuits, motor controllers, and motor

control centers.

IMO 430 is more directly related to your application than 312

 

[ADub]

Fair enough so far. What about the "adequate space" wording in 430.10? Maybe it's just me but adding (4) 12 THWN through a 30a 600 volt fusible disconnect doesn't seem too taxing to me

 

[ADub]

My experience is that you will not win this.

I already lost. I just want some other opinions since this piece of work refused to have any type of discussion with me

 

[cadpoint]

Your dealing with a different animal!

State Elevator Code - Iowa

Nation Wide

Search engine results

You are in their space and most elevator mechanic's will let you know it.

Last time I worked one, they also let it be known that I could not use their cabinet
or their vertical raceway. They did tell me where I could leave their circuit coiled in
a box! Nice enough crew!

 

[Smart $]

Fair enough so far. What about the "adequate space" wording in 430.10? Maybe it's just me but adding (4) 12 THWN through a 30a 600 volt fusible disconnect doesn't seem too taxing to me

I agree you are compliant provided you installed the warning label... but the reality of it is likely...

...you will not win this.

 

[AHMED BAYOUMI]

Thank you

 

[augie47]

I think many inspectors would look at it in light of 312.8 and accept it.
Elevator inspectors have, for the most part, always been a little closer to god than the rest of us.

"winning is not an option"