Engineering supervision…

I

Isaiah

Senior Member
Location
Baton Rouge
Occupation
Electrical Inspector
In general can “engineering supervision” overrule the NEC?
Examples: 240.86(A), 310.10(G)(1) exception.


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G

ggunn

PE (Electrical), NABCEP certified
Location
Austin, TX, USA
Occupation
Consulting Electrical Engineer - Photovoltaic Systems
Isaiah said:
In general can “engineering supervision” overrule the NEC?
Examples: 240.86(A), 310.10(G)(1) exception.
Click to expand...
No, engineering supervision is a provision of the NEC, not a way to overrule it.
 
T

tburdick

Member
Location
IOWA
Occupation
journeyman
I have worked many factory / Industrial calls in my career.

Many if not most think that with the job under the auspices of an engineer, they go against the NEC.

A few of those times pointing out NEC violation got me laid off!!


That didn't happen on the Minooka co-gen
 
J

jim dungar

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Wisconsin
Occupation
PE (Retired) - Power Systems
tburdick said:
I have worked many factory / Industrial calls in my career.

Many if not most think that with the job under the auspices of an engineer, they go against the NEC.

A few of those times pointing out NEC violation got me laid off!!


That didn't happen on the Minooka co-gen
Click to expand...

When I entered the industry some 50 years ago many heavy industrial facilities, particularly in the 'rust belt" region, were not subject to state AHJ control and inspections after the original building construction. However, over the past few decades, insurance costs and litigation have caused many of these states to apply the NEC to all installations, however many processes and machines are still not routinely inspected.
 
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qcroanoke

qcroanoke

Sometimes I don't know if I'm the boxer or the bag
Location
Roanoke, VA.
Occupation
Sorta retired........
Had an engineer tell me once " I have no problem with it so we're going to do it"
He backed off after it was pointed out:
1. You can't override the code
2. The company will not allow this since we know it's a code violation and can't be defended in court.
 
G

ggunn

PE (Electrical), NABCEP certified
Location
Austin, TX, USA
Occupation
Consulting Electrical Engineer - Photovoltaic Systems
qcroanoke said:
Had an engineer tell me once " I have no problem with it so we're going to do it"
He backed off after it was pointed out:
1. You can't override the code
2. The company will not allow this since we know it's a code violation and can't be defended in court.
Click to expand...
An engineer can only invoke "engineering supervision" in situations where the NEC explicitly allows it.
 
qcroanoke

qcroanoke

Sometimes I don't know if I'm the boxer or the bag
Location
Roanoke, VA.
Occupation
Sorta retired........
ggunn said:
An engineer can only invoke "engineering supervision" in situations where the NEC explicitly allows it.
Click to expand...
He didn't care. He saw no problem with it.
Code or no code.
He came around to our way of thinking once he realized we weren't going to allow him to bluff his way through.
 
G

ggunn

PE (Electrical), NABCEP certified
Location
Austin, TX, USA
Occupation
Consulting Electrical Engineer - Photovoltaic Systems
electrofelon said:
I don't think "supersede" is the correct word. I would say "engineering supervision" is an alternate method that is allowed sometimes.
Click to expand...
Yes. If it is a provision of the NEC it does not supersede the NEC. 705.12(B)(6) does not supersede the other provisions of 705.12(B).
 
J

jaggedben

Senior Member
Location
Northern California
Occupation
Solar and Energy Storage Installer
ggunn said:
Yes. If it is a provision of the NEC it does not supersede the NEC.
Click to expand...

I agree completely so far.

705.12(B)(6) does not supersede the other provisions of 705.12(B).
Click to expand...

Well, yes it does, because it effectively says so, explicitly. But only those specific sections it mentions, and that's all internal to 705.12(B), not to mention the internal to the NEC.
 
charlie b

charlie b

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Lockport, IL
Occupation
Retired Electrical Engineer
Speaking as an engineer, I would not want the power to overrule the NEC, nor would I want the risk (financial and professional) that it would entail. Furthermore, there are things the NEC allows an engineer to do that I would never choose to do. You want examples? Perhaps after I have another cup of coffee. 😉
 
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