Entrance to Working Space
- Thread starter lizzie14
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Bremerton, Washington
- Occupation
- Master Electrician
Re: Entrance to Working Space
We need to look at the intent, which is to quickly exit the space in an emergency. Ask your self, if I just got a bad flash burn, how unobstructed do I want the path to the exit?
We need to look at the intent, which is to quickly exit the space in an emergency. Ask your self, if I just got a bad flash burn, how unobstructed do I want the path to the exit?
websparky
Senior Member
- Location
- Cleveland, Ohio
Re: Entrance to Working Space
Here is a reference for consideration of what "unobstucted" means.
Here is a reference for consideration of what "unobstucted" means.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Entrance to Working Space
In the fire marshal inspections I witnessed in retail stores, etc. they wanted a clear three foot path from room to room and front to back of the building. That was their definition of unobstructed. Plus they wanted the clear space in front of any panel.
In the fire marshal inspections I witnessed in retail stores, etc. they wanted a clear three foot path from room to room and front to back of the building. That was their definition of unobstructed. Plus they wanted the clear space in front of any panel.
- Location
- Massachusetts
Re: Entrance to Working Space
Doesn't 110.26(C)(2) stop on the outside of the electric room?
In other words inside the electric room you need a clear and unobstructed path to the electric room door but once outside the electric room the 110.26(C)(2) requirements end.
I know many people dislike the handbook but I will go for it anyway.
If you look at Exhibits 110.12, 110.14, 110.15 and 110.16 in the handbook it seems the code is only concerned with the inside of the electric room.
Specifically with one door you should not have to walk around the switch gear that is experiencing a fault to get to the door.
That said the Code that Dave put up may take over once outside the electric room.
Doesn't 110.26(C)(2) stop on the outside of the electric room?
In other words inside the electric room you need a clear and unobstructed path to the electric room door but once outside the electric room the 110.26(C)(2) requirements end.
I know many people dislike the handbook but I will go for it anyway.
If you look at Exhibits 110.12, 110.14, 110.15 and 110.16 in the handbook it seems the code is only concerned with the inside of the electric room.
Specifically with one door you should not have to walk around the switch gear that is experiencing a fault to get to the door.
I do not see that those sections require a clear path to outside the building just a clear path to outside the electric room.
That said the Code that Dave put up may take over once outside the electric room.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Entrance to Working Space
My answer goes beyond the scope of the NEC and my answers covers a real life scenario where Fire Marshals are enforcing the NEC and a host of other NFPA and other national and local codes. Their biggest issue in a fire inspection seems to be keeping a clear path for egress. They also worry about open dumpsters up against buildings; inventory all the way to the ceiling (not allowed); etc. Sorry to stray beyond the NEC.
Bob (iWire) I must say you've really got your finger on the practical application of the NEC. Kudos for all your helpful & constructive answers here. I love you man!
[Edited to add signature. It shows in the preview, but only sticks about 50% of the time. Note to webmaster: Why is this?].
../Wayne C.
[ October 30, 2003, 10:59 AM: Message edited by: awwt ]
My answer goes beyond the scope of the NEC and my answers covers a real life scenario where Fire Marshals are enforcing the NEC and a host of other NFPA and other national and local codes. Their biggest issue in a fire inspection seems to be keeping a clear path for egress. They also worry about open dumpsters up against buildings; inventory all the way to the ceiling (not allowed); etc. Sorry to stray beyond the NEC.
Bob (iWire) I must say you've really got your finger on the practical application of the NEC. Kudos for all your helpful & constructive answers here. I love you man!
[Edited to add signature. It shows in the preview, but only sticks about 50% of the time. Note to webmaster: Why is this?].
../Wayne C.
[ October 30, 2003, 10:59 AM: Message edited by: awwt ]
- Location
- Lockport, IL
- Occupation
- Semi-Retired Electrical Engineer
Re: Entrance to Working Space
This is slightly off topic, and I can?t back it up with a code reference, but here?s my interpretation. Suppose you go through one door into an electric room. Suppose the other side of the electric room has another door that leads to a storage room from which there is no other exit. I believe that you can only count the electric room as having one door. Since the second door has no path to the outside world, it does not count.
I?ll go one step further. If, as you stand in front of an electrical panel, the one and only one door to the room is on your right, and if the hinges to the panel?s front cover are on the right side, so that the open panel cover is between you and the exit door, you have a violation. I consider the panel?s front cover as being an ?obstruction,? in the context of 110.26(C)(2).
ryan_618
Senior Member
- Location
- Salt Lake City, Utah
Re: Entrance to Working Space
Do you consider it unobstructed if you were required to run through the required working clearance of another panelboard in the same room?
Example: 1200A panel blows up and I turn and run. I have to run directly in front of a 2000A panel in an effort to get out....
Do you consider it unobstructed if you were required to run through the required working clearance of another panelboard in the same room?
Example: 1200A panel blows up and I turn and run. I have to run directly in front of a 2000A panel in an effort to get out....
- Location
- Lockport, IL
- Occupation
- Semi-Retired Electrical Engineer
Re: Entrance to Working Space
Yes, I would call it unobstructed. But I would change that call if a second person was working on that other panel, and if the open panel cover was in the path between myself and the door.
Yes, I would call it unobstructed. But I would change that call if a second person was working on that other panel, and if the open panel cover was in the path between myself and the door.
Re: Entrance to Working Space
I worked a water purification pump station here in the city. It had two entrance doors where one of them stayed latched with mechanical latches and the other had a door knob to turn to open. We had to change out the 1600 amp switchgear and to get it to code had to purchase panic hardware and make the mechanically latched door the one that opened and the other half mechanically latched. We had a main breaker in the 1600 Amp switchgear feeding another 1200 amp switchgear which was placed where we didnt have the required working distance between it and a piece of equipment in front of it. The inspector allowed us to dial the 1200 amp main breaker down to 90 percent of the trip rating making it trip at less than 1200 amps and relabel the breaker for that amount so the lack of distance between the two pieces of equipment would then pass code because it was less than 1200 amps. Also on the other end of the room for our second means of egress was a stairway leading down twenty feet to the pump station floor. Wouldnt want to take that stairway after an arc blast to the face but would rather do that than stand in front of the arc and get burned worse.
I worked a water purification pump station here in the city. It had two entrance doors where one of them stayed latched with mechanical latches and the other had a door knob to turn to open. We had to change out the 1600 amp switchgear and to get it to code had to purchase panic hardware and make the mechanically latched door the one that opened and the other half mechanically latched. We had a main breaker in the 1600 Amp switchgear feeding another 1200 amp switchgear which was placed where we didnt have the required working distance between it and a piece of equipment in front of it. The inspector allowed us to dial the 1200 amp main breaker down to 90 percent of the trip rating making it trip at less than 1200 amps and relabel the breaker for that amount so the lack of distance between the two pieces of equipment would then pass code because it was less than 1200 amps. Also on the other end of the room for our second means of egress was a stairway leading down twenty feet to the pump station floor. Wouldnt want to take that stairway after an arc blast to the face but would rather do that than stand in front of the arc and get burned worse.
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