Extending a GEC

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Fred B

Fred B

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Location
Upstate, NY
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Electrician
Got a situation where will be moving a 120/240 residential panelbox. Would like to splice the #4 stranded GEC to get the added length needed to reach. Would be using Brady crimps for the splices. Area of splice in area not normally considered "subject to damage". Any reason the splice would need to be in an enclosure of some sort?
 
Fred B said:
Got a situation where will be moving a 120/240 residential panelbox. Would like to splice the #4 stranded GEC to get the added length needed to reach. Would be using Brady crimps for the splices. Area of splice in area not normally considered "subject to damage". Any reason the splice would need to be in an enclosure of some sort?
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I cant think of anything why it would need to be. Was the idea of the enclosure just to protect it or to be accessible.

I’m guessing to protect it since it is a irreversible connection.
 
infinity said:
No the splice would not need to be in an enclosure, just needs to be irreversible.
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Do you have any idea on why they want it to be irreversible at only the splice since it probably has acorn nuts on the ground rods that are not irreversible? Just wondering.
 
The splicing device must also be listed for grounding. I don't know what the differences are but there often is same catalog number but with a -G suffix that is listed for grounding.
 
frofro19 said:
Do you have any idea on why they want it to be irreversible at only the splice since it probably has acorn nuts on the ground rods that are not irreversible? Just wondering.
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Good question, I have no idea. You can tap to a GEC with a spit bolt too.
 
infinity said:
Good question, I have no idea. You can tap to a GEC with a spit bolt too.
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Taps off of a GEC are bonding jumpers though. You can't splice a GEC as a general rule other than by use of irreversible splicing methods.

You can't cut the GEC to make a tap to it but you can make a tap that doesn't interrupt the GEC in any way.
 
kwired said:
Taps off of a GEC are bonding jumpers though. You can't splice a GEC as a general rule other than by use of irreversible splicing methods.

You can't cut the GEC to make a tap to it but you can make a tap that doesn't interrupt the GEC in any way.
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Exactly and none of it makes sense.
 
GoldDigger said:
My only guess is that it is intended to minimize inadvertent interruption of the GES, either by an electrician or other trade or owner.
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I agree that is likely what someone was thinking when they came up with this requirement but it's somewhat bogus when so many other components of the same system allow for mechanical connections that could just as easily be inadvertently interrupted.
 
infinity said:
I agree that is likely what someone was thinking when they came up with this requirement but it's somewhat bogus when so many other components of the same system allow for mechanical connections that could just as easily be inadvertently interrupted.
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I agree and for the reasons you mention the irreversible thing has always been a mystery to me. In my view this should be removed from the code.
 
texie said:
I agree and for the reasons you mention the irreversible thing has always been a mystery to me. In my view this should be removed from the code.
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I also agree. Sorry to inject a little mini rant here but this is one thing that drives me crazy about the NEC is they don't revisit and fix some of these stupid things that have been in there for decades. Part of having a good code standard is not just adding new things as they are deemed necessary but fixing crap from the past too, and that they just refuse to do.
 
I look at it a little different.

The wire that is the GEC the code want's if as free from splices as possible. It's connected in the panel to the neutral bar and to the metal water pipe (or other approved electrode). Any splices have to be irreversible and you can tap it without cutting to pick up the phone/cable tv grounding etc..

I think the GEC is important and should be treated the way it is.

JMHO
 
Eddie702 said:
I think the GEC is important and should be treated the way it is.

JMHO
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The gec is by far the least important conductor. What exactly is it doing? If it's an mgn distribution system the system is already very well grounded. Even if not, the system is very likely to still be grounded through equipment frames, water pipes, at the pole, mounting structures etc.
 
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Eddie702 said:
I look at it a little different.

The wire that is the GEC the code want's if as free from splices as possible. It's connected in the panel to the neutral bar and to the metal water pipe (or other approved electrode). Any splices have to be irreversible and you can tap it without cutting to pick up the phone/cable tv grounding etc..

I think the GEC is important and should be treated the way it is.

JMHO
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What makes you think the GEC is all that important? What does it do that makes it important? To me it is pretty much superfluous for most cases. In most cases if it was never installed it wouldn't matter, nor would it substantially change the level of safety of the installation if it was not there.
 
My take on why it has to be irreversible is so some unknowledgeable person in the future doesn't decide, "oh, this is in the way of what I need to do" and takes it apart and says "oh, nothing bad happened, it must be ok". Now, why they don't make an easier to install irreversible connector I have always wondered.
 
petersonra said:
What makes you think the GEC is all that important? What does it do that makes it important? To me it is pretty much superfluous for most cases. In most cases if it was never installed it wouldn't matter, nor would it substantially change the level of safety of the installation if it was not there.
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I've never viewed it as very important either. In many cases less than 100' away the neutral is already connected to the earth at the POCO transformer. IMO the MBJ is far more important.
 
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