Fact or fiction?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Gee..I hope not....let's see :
90 condo units each w/ about 5 split
84 condo units each w/about 4 split

That will be one heavy redo bill.
 
Re: Fact or fiction?

electrofelon said:
Another electrician told me the other day that you can't split wire a duplex receptacle anymore, unless the recept is approved for such use. Fact or fiction? I vote fiction.
Click to expand...

My vote is this is a fact!
How would you split wire a GFCI?
 
Mike
That is a broad statement for such a specific section of work we do. Are you saying the a living room, bedroom, or family room duplex receptacle is not permitted to be split any more, such as in switching one half and steady power to the other half?
 
Fiction. And Mike's example is incorrect. One example of when you cannot do it doesn't make it a fact. If you could find one example that says you can do it this would make the original statement fiction.
 
Fiction

Fiction

I do this for jetted tubs when the tub has a circuit for the pump and a circuit for the heater. You do need to install a handle tie on the breaker in this instance.

Switched ,half/hot, plugs are still allowed.
 
pierre said:
Mike
That is a broad statement for such a specific section of work we do. Are you saying the a living room, bedroom, or family room duplex receptacle is not permitted to be split any more, such as in switching one half and steady power to the other half?
Click to expand...


Pierre, this is not what I am saying at all. The question is about them being ?apprpved?

Originally posted by electrofelon
Another electrician told me the other day that you can't split wire a duplex receptacle anymore, unless the recept is approved for such use. Fact or fiction? I vote fiction.
Click to expand...


Originally posted by jwelectric
My vote is this is a fact!
How would you split wire a GFCI?
Click to expand...


Are you trying to tell me that most duplex receptacle is not listed to have a break away tab.
Are you making the statement that these receptacles are not listed to be installed as a split device?

I am making the statement that these devices are listed to be installed in this manner and if they weren?t then it would be a violation to install them that way.

The reason we have been installing them this because they were listed for this type of installation or approved by a third party.

Then we must understand just what ?approved? means if we choose to use this word in this question.
Approved. Acceptable to the authority having jurisdiction.
Based on the definition of the word approved then I stand by my statement that ALL duplex receptacles MUST be approved.
 
I reckon Mike's got a point. It just seems silly to make such a statement, because it can be wildly misread, as we all have.

I think that's probably how myths start.

When the 2005 came out, an inspector told me that washers would all have to be GFCI protected, or on a single receptacle. At that time, it hadn't come to my attention of the revised wording regarding laundry sinks, which would require any receptacle within 6' of a sink to be GFI protected. It was nothing to do with washing machines, and he'd spun off in a whole new orbit about how you could plug something into the washer receptacle, and then drop it into the washing machine when it was full of water. "A great idea, a good change to the code," he said.

Together we looked through 210.8, 210.11, and 210.52(F) searching for the source of this "washing machine" code. He'd decided not to enforce it until he figured out what the heck was going on. I figured it out a while later. :D

Moral: Half truths spawn whole lies. :)
 
To be more specific, by split he meant there were two different "phases" with a shared neutral. I gather he thinks a half switched recep is ok. Also he said that the type of recepts that are approved for this are typically the commercial grade ones. He also says schedule 80 is required underground, so he holds other falsities.
 
210.7(C) in 2002
210.7(B) in 2005

The ungrounded conductors must have a disconnecting means to simultaneously disconnect the power supplying the device. Handle tie or two pole breaker ....

Also 210.4(B)

Can't find the "approved" part anywhere
 
George
The change in 210.8 regarding laundry sinks has no exception. Therefore, a single receptacle would not be permitted - meaning a GFCI protected receptacle within 6 ft would be the way to go. This is sure to screw people up for a while, unless it is revised in '08/'11.
 
electrofelon, was he talking about spliting a duplex receptacle rated at 15 Amps on a 20 Amp. circuit. Because if you split them and that was the only receptacle on the circuit I can see where you could have a problem.
 
Question- does it violate the listing to remove the power cord on a washer and direct wire it? Just for a good time I think I might try direct wiring a few washing machines and put a switch to disconect them right above the unit. We just adopted 2005, and now all the inspectors in this town will come armed with a printout of new things to look for. I really don't want to do anything not to code or violate a listing, but I do like to have my fun when I can.
 
Technically you can not ever violate a "listing". A listing says the equipment was manufactured according to a set of standards.

You can, however, violate a manufacturers "instructions".

If you change things from the way they were manufactured or intended to be used, it is up to the AHJ to evaluate the changes and then pass judgement.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top