"farming out" (or in)

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ishium 80439

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Denver foothills via the Horn of Africa
In the past I have worked for companies that had an informal labor pool agreement. That is to say that if one got slow and the other had work, they would "lend" some employees. Does anyone have any personal experience with the nuts and bolts of such an agreement? I potentially have a job that is larger than I can man and was talking to an old apprentice of mine (from another company) and he told me that the company he is currently working for is slow. I am considering approaching the owner of that company and asking him if he would let me use his crew for this project. Anyone have any thoughts on the ins/outs, ups/ downs of such an arrangement? Am I expected to pay his employees directly (doesn't seem likely)? Or do I cut the company a check based on what the owner tells me hourly salary plus burden is (seems like he had an incentive to exaggerate)?

Thanks in advance
 
When I was an apprentice, the shop I worked for had such an agreement with another outfit. They would "lend" JWs and apprentices to each other depending on work load. Now, I don't know the details of the agreement, for all I know the owners could have been fishing buddies :roll:, but when I worked at the other shop's jobs I still got the check from my primary employer. I guess, any agreement is negotiable and acceptable if you two agree to it :grin:
 
Many years ago, I used to work for several Irish contractors who would all meet for coffee in the morning. As well as the crews for each. 50 guys show up for coffee at 7am and get into different trucks everyday. The coffee shop was the labor pool, and the bar down two doors was the hiring hall. That went on for better part of a decade.... Bosses bickering over who got who - waving guys to this or that truck - but the guy who acually employed you and paid you got priority. I spent 6 months working for one guy everyday while being paid by another untill the job was done - then back to another crew, different boss - same paycheck. Then back to my actual employer.

Then the neighborhood changed for the better in some peoples minds - and I think they all went their seperate ways. Still see most of them around - but not at the bar or the coffee shop... The guy who started it all is still around - he still works and is 75+ years old. All of the EC's at one point all worked for him over the years.

What was great about it was that each shop had about 5 guys, but each EC would land a really big one every once in a while (Far beyond what a small shop could do) and even the bosses would work for eachother, and all pitch in.
 
What it sounds like is you would be sub contracting this other guy. You pay him x # $ per hour per man. He pays his guys like normal with any bennies. But you need to be careful with workers comp. ins. and such. Also there is that little thing about Federal income tax if these guys are working under your direction, following your instructions they can be considered your employees. I did this once with another contractor, I gave him the lighting lay out, had fixtures on site and walked away. I did not tell him or his crew HOW to do the job that way he was a sub contractor to me and I wrote his bill off on taxes and sent him a 1099.
 
Hi,
IMO there is to much risk in this day and age to swap workers anymore. You are open to all kinds of problems but mostly insurance and I don't even like to say the name but I.R.S. issues. Try www.clp.com they are a national agency that supplies electricians, plumbers , etc. I use them now and then and have had good luck. They provide the electrician and all the workers comp and everything else for an hourly price. Here in MA. I pay anywhere between 38.00 to 42.00 an hour for a commercial electrician. Around 20.00 for an 3 to 4 year apprentice. They bill you weekly all you do is send the check. If you don't like the guys or guy they send you can send them back the 1st day without a charge and ask for others.

Mark
 
The company that I work for uses clp on some of our bigger jobs. I don't know all the details but they will work when you need bodies. Most of the electricians in we have gotten from them are not the greatest but aren't terrible either. We have hired a few of the better ones on full time. I think they give you the option to buy them out.
 
DIRT27 said:
The company that I work for uses clp on some of our bigger jobs. I don't know all the details but they will work when you need bodies. Most of the electricians in we have gotten from them are not the greatest but aren't terrible either. We have hired a few of the better ones on full time. I think they give you the option to buy them out.
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I agree. Sometimes I've got some guys that were not so good but I send them back. But I have been able to complete some good size jobs with one or two and even up to four of their guys. They make you sign a contract not to hire their people within a year unless you give them a finders fee of like 1800.00 or something like that.

Mark
 
I've borrowed guys before, but have gotten better quality men for cheaper placing an add in the paper. I have an ad for guys on Craigslist starting today. There are a lot of good guys out of work right now. I'm a little squeamish about hiring someone that is currently working at the moment. I know that seems backwards, but I would not feel bad about giving someone a couple weeks pay than laying him back off if I slowed back down. I'm as busy as ever but it is harder than ever to get paid. GC's that I have worked for and never had a problem with in the past are slow pay at the moment.
 
bradleyelectric said:
I've borrowed guys before, but have gotten better quality men for cheaper placing an add in the paper. I have an ad for guys on Craigslist starting today. There are a lot of good guys out of work right now. I'm a little squeamish about hiring someone that is currently working at the moment. I know that seems backwards, but I would not feel bad about giving someone a couple weeks pay than laying him back off if I slowed back down. I'm as busy as ever but it is harder than ever to get paid. GC's that I have worked for and never had a problem with in the past are slow pay at the moment.
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When things are slow their labor pool goes up and some of the better guys start working for them again because a lot of them work for themselves and are slow. You kinda have to plan it right. The point is if you hire anyone out of an add or something like that you better cover them on your insurance comp, and liability in case of not only of someone getting hurt but also damage to the plant or equipment. My customers won't allow anybody in their buildings not covered by comp. Also if you pay them on the books your insurance co will see it in your audit and your policy gos up. I just find it cheaper and less work for me to use the agency when I just need extra bodies.
Mark
 
Thanks for the input. For some reason I can't get on the CLP web site right now so I don't know if they have a branch in the Denver area. The trading crews thing does make me a bit leery as far as taxes, insurance etc and that is why I asked. It definately seems a lot cleaner going to an outside agency but I also see a benefit to developing a relationship for when I am slow and perhaps someone else has work.

As a side note... Up The Irish!!. Unfortunately I think those days are done. Sounds like that was an arrangement that worked for everyone. I'll try not to turn this into one of those "good old days" threads. (but didn't it seem simpler back then?)
 
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