I was on a job today and I had to cut a box in seperation wall on a condo. 1 1/4 thick drywall so it was fire rated ( how many hours?). What are the options of boxes to use I cant find any UL stamped boxes that are cut in. This box is in a kit cabinet so acess behind the box is totally out of the question.
fire rated walls and boxes.
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mdshunk
Senior Member
- Location
- Right here.
Re: fire rated walls and boxes.
How about a wiremold v5747 on the surface and forget about messing around with the fire wall?
How about a wiremold v5747 on the surface and forget about messing around with the fire wall?
Re: fire rated walls and boxes.
I agree with Mdshunk, especially since this is a seperation between two dwellings.
In reality the only way any box (metal or plastic) can be installed in a rated wall is to fasten it to the framing, in otherwords madion straps or expanding type attachments on the box itself doesn't comply with the following UL info, but the last paragraph may be the biggest stopper.
From Volume One of the UL Fire Resistance Directory.
WALL AND PARTITION ASSEMBLIES
Metallic Eletrical Outlet Boxes
Listed single and double gang metallic outlet and switch boxes with metallic or nonmetalliccover plates may be used in bearing and nonbearing wood stud and steel stud walls with ratings not exceeding 2h. These walls shall have gypsum wallboard facings similar to those shown in Design Nos. U301,U411, and U425. The metallic outlet or switch boxes shall be securely fastened to the studs and the opening in the wallboard facing shall be cut so that the clearance between the box and the wallboard does not exceed 1/8 in. The surface area of individual metallic outlet or switch boxes shall not exceed 16 sq in. The aggregate surface area of the boxes shall not exceed 100 sq in per 100 sq ft of wall surface.
Metallic boxes located on opposite sides of walls or partitions shall be seperated by a minimum horizontal distance of 24in. This minimum seperation distance between metallic boxes may be reduced when "Wall Opening Protective Materials" (CLIV) are installed according to the requirements of their Classification.
Metallic boxes shall not be installed on opposite side of walls or partitions of staggered stud construction unless "Wall Opening Protective Materials" are installed according to the requirements of their Classification.
Roger
I agree with Mdshunk, especially since this is a seperation between two dwellings.
In reality the only way any box (metal or plastic) can be installed in a rated wall is to fasten it to the framing, in otherwords madion straps or expanding type attachments on the box itself doesn't comply with the following UL info, but the last paragraph may be the biggest stopper.
From Volume One of the UL Fire Resistance Directory.
WALL AND PARTITION ASSEMBLIES
Metallic Eletrical Outlet Boxes
Listed single and double gang metallic outlet and switch boxes with metallic or nonmetalliccover plates may be used in bearing and nonbearing wood stud and steel stud walls with ratings not exceeding 2h. These walls shall have gypsum wallboard facings similar to those shown in Design Nos. U301,U411, and U425. The metallic outlet or switch boxes shall be securely fastened to the studs and the opening in the wallboard facing shall be cut so that the clearance between the box and the wallboard does not exceed 1/8 in. The surface area of individual metallic outlet or switch boxes shall not exceed 16 sq in. The aggregate surface area of the boxes shall not exceed 100 sq in per 100 sq ft of wall surface.
Metallic boxes located on opposite sides of walls or partitions shall be seperated by a minimum horizontal distance of 24in. This minimum seperation distance between metallic boxes may be reduced when "Wall Opening Protective Materials" (CLIV) are installed according to the requirements of their Classification.
Metallic boxes shall not be installed on opposite side of walls or partitions of staggered stud construction unless "Wall Opening Protective Materials" are installed according to the requirements of their Classification.
Roger
ryan_618
Senior Member
- Location
- Salt Lake City, Utah
Re: fire rated walls and boxes.
See section R321 of the IRC, which requires two one hour walls or one two hour wall.Originally posted by be4jc:
A two hour firewall on a condo WHY?
What jurisdiction requires this and again WHY?
Dwellings only require 1hr. seperation
bphgravity
Senior Member
- Location
- Florida
Re: fire rated walls and boxes.
At least, this is what the building official here is telling us.
If the individual dwelling units are individually owned, 2hr ratings are required. If the condo in whole is owned and rented or leased to tenants, 1hr ratings are accepted.Originally posted by be4jc:
A two hour firewall on a condo WHY?
What jurisdiction requires this and again WHY?
Dwellings only require 1hr. seperation
At least, this is what the building official here is telling us.
allenwayne
Senior Member
Re: fire rated walls and boxes.
Bryan about 100 miles north of you they require a 2 hr rating if in same bay but ptty pads rimg it up to par
Bryan about 100 miles north of you they require a 2 hr rating if in same bay but ptty pads rimg it up to par
jwelectric
Senior Member
- Location
- North Carolina
Re: fire rated walls and boxes.
I have wired multi family dwellings all over the state of North Carolina and at least two thirds of the multi family dwellings of Forsyth County in the late ?70s and early ?80s. I have done timeshares in the vacation parts of our mountains and condos and apartments in some of our biggest cities such as Charlotte, Greensboro, Durham, Wilmington, Raleigh and Winston Salem.
In the early ?90s I worked on apartments for Disney World in Orlando Florida as well as some of the apartments in Altamonte Springs, Winter Park, and Jacksonville Florida. Lived on Spanish soil with my Mother?s sister while working in Jacksonville.
The one thing that I have never done is use a box pad. I always felt that the world was a lot better off if I just added a stud between the two boxes or cover one of them with rock. I have always felt that pads could and would come off and should be outlawed.
Edited just because it is before coffee time
[ September 14, 2005, 04:29 AM: Message edited by: jwelectric ]
I have wired multi family dwellings all over the state of North Carolina and at least two thirds of the multi family dwellings of Forsyth County in the late ?70s and early ?80s. I have done timeshares in the vacation parts of our mountains and condos and apartments in some of our biggest cities such as Charlotte, Greensboro, Durham, Wilmington, Raleigh and Winston Salem.
In the early ?90s I worked on apartments for Disney World in Orlando Florida as well as some of the apartments in Altamonte Springs, Winter Park, and Jacksonville Florida. Lived on Spanish soil with my Mother?s sister while working in Jacksonville.
The one thing that I have never done is use a box pad. I always felt that the world was a lot better off if I just added a stud between the two boxes or cover one of them with rock. I have always felt that pads could and would come off and should be outlawed.
Edited just because it is before coffee time
[ September 14, 2005, 04:29 AM: Message edited by: jwelectric ]
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