Fire Wall Penetration Plan Detail

[JP23]

A plan detail depicts a 2" emt penetrating a CMU block wall between the
electrical room and a retail store. The detail specifies that 4PCF mineral wool is to
be packed around the conduit leaving a recess for 1/2" of Flamesafe IPC FSP 1000
putty to be packed in the recess at both ends. The mineral wool specified comes in large
rigid sheets. This detail does not make sense to me since the mineral wool material
from the sheet would lose it's density when breaking it from the sheets and then
repacking it would also change the density. I can get regular mineral/rock wool locally
but the 4PCF is a bulk special order. Does the pounds per cubic foot of the
material really matter in this situation or am I missing something?

 

[flatlander]

Sounds like a mistake somewhere. We have used mineral wool or glass fiber as the packing. Never a rigid sheet.

 

[dkidd]

Ask for the UL assembly designator.

 

[roger]

The detail must have an assembly number, can you post it?

The "Metacaulk" website or the UL orange books will show the actual assembly.

Roger

 

[mgookin]

That does sound strange.
What do they show inside the conduit?
What's going to hold it in place?
It would be more reasonable to have mortar around the pipe and mineral wool packed inside the pipe after you pull your wires.

 

[Chamuit]

Sounds more like packing or fill between the two putty points on the surface of the block.

 

[JP23]

Thanks for the input! I wasn't able to contact the engineer earlier
so I thought I'd post the question here. Still haven't made contact but
just fired off an email requesting the UL designator which I can post
if I receive it. There's three penetrations total. The conduit will contain
either fiber or feeder conductors.

 

[roger]

Thanks for the input! I wasn't able to contact the engineer earlier
so I thought I'd post the question here. Still haven't made contact but
just fired off an email requesting the UL designator which I can post
if I receive it. There's three penetrations total. The conduit will contain
either fiber or feeder conductors.

So you are saying none of the drawing details be it A, M, P, or E have an assembly number attached to it?

A design Architect or Engineer can not (in my experience) just out of the blue come up with an assembly.

Roger

 

[JP23]

So you are saying none of the drawing details be it A, M, P, or E have an assembly number attached to it?

A design Architect or Engineer can not (in my experience) just out of the blue come up with an assembly.

Roger

Yes, the drawing is a side view of the wall showing the emt passing through the cored hole
with the internal void around the conduit packed with mineral wool. 1/2" of
putty is to be packed around the ends flush with the wall. There is not an
assembly number on the detail.

 

[JFletcher]

Is it normal for such detail to include specific brands of firestop? Could you not use Hilti or 3M or any other firestop that maintains the rating of the wall?

Also, I've rarely seen a core drill much larger than the conduit designed to go into it. Most times there is just enough space to pack putty to the correct annular fill and rockwool or batting wouldnt be used at all in the hole. Is this just a 1hr rated wall?

 

[JP23]

Is it normal for such detail to include specific brands of firestop? Could you not use Hilti or 3M or any other firestop that maintains the rating of the wall?

Also, I've rarely seen a core drill much larger than the conduit designed to go into it. Most times there is just enough space to pack putty to the correct annular fill and rockwool or batting wouldnt be used at all in the hole. Is this just a 1hr rated wall?

I'm still not sure what the rating of the wall is yet. I was planning on coring 3" holes so the fittings would be
flush with the wall. This portion of the work has taken over a month to schedule since it has to be
done after hours and the store wants an employee to be present. Hoping to not run into an issue
with the inspector and have to reschedule for a second trip. Usually an inspector will say he
wants it done exactly per plan but in this case I'm concerned the detail may not be accurate.

 

[mgookin]

Yes, the drawing is a side view of the wall showing the emt passing through the cored hole
with the internal void around the conduit packed with mineral wool. 1/2" of
putty is to be packed around the ends flush with the wall. There is not an
assembly number on the detail.

So this is a raceway?
Previously I thought it was a sleeve.

 

[JP23]

So this is a raceway?
Previously I thought it was a sleeve.

Yes, raceways for fiber and power. The A&E said to do it per plan but the mineral
wool didn't have to be 4PCF. There's other 2" penetrations in the same wall that
don't have any fire sealant in them and the building is only a few years old.