"Fun" Service Upgrade

[jeff43222]

Just got back from looking at a potential service upgrade job. It's a side-by-side duplex (each side has two stories), built in 1951, each unit with original 60A service with add-on single-fuse and double-fuse boxes cobbled together off the main fuse box. Owner told me his insurance company is requiring him to upgrade to 100A on each side.

The current mast is buried inside the outer wall (weather head sticking out on the second floor), and it goes into the rental side's basement. As far as I could tell, it then pierces the block foundation between the two units and goes into the other unit's main fuse box. Both fuse boxes are located in cabinets in bathrooms, under duct work, behind the plumbing stack, etc. -- hard to get to and in cramped quarters all around. Meters are inside the basements. Most of each basement is also finished. Both units have 10 kW electric ranges. One unit also has an electric dryer, and the other has a 240V window A/C.

Just about everything about this job made me want to run away screaming. Because of the layout of the house, there's really no place to put the service into the house except roughly where it is now. Obviously, the new panelboards can't be put in the bathrooms, and the owner doesn't want to tear them out (he just put new plumbing fixtures in two weeks ago). Moving the panels somewhere else will require outside disconnect switches, and there's really no good place to put the panels anyway. About the only redeeming aspect about the whole thing is that the owner and tenant were nice folks.

I'm curious is this sort of job is the kind that most ECs would just avoid outright as way too big of a PITA. Or would you just tell the owner the bad news that it's going to be destructive and very expensive?

 

[mdshunk]

Re: "Fun" Service Upgrade

I do mostly old work, and PITA service changes like this are somewhat routine for me. Just devise your plan of attack, prepare a realistic money making bid that will account for your plan and the time it will take to accomplish. Lay all your cards on the table ahead of time with the building owner with respect to where you plan to mount your equipment, and detail any damage that you expect to be doing to the building's finish materials. These aren't nearly as satisfying as the "in and out by noon" ranch house type service changes, but they are more profitable. Many electrician's will avoid work like this, so your competition is greatly reduced.

Don't rule out putting the tennant panels in the basement or other common area and running the branch circuits in pipe from the new tennant panels to the existing bathroom tennant panels. This will allow you to gut the existing panels and use them as junction boxes for all the branch circuits.

 

[cselectric]

Re: "Fun" Service Upgrade

I'd run screaming from that mess. But if you decide not to do the same, remember these three little words: "time and materials." No way I would ever contract such a project.

 

[tshea]

Re: "Fun" Service Upgrade

First, Check your AHJ and find out if there are any local ordinances, rules, etc that could muck up the job.
Second, Write up a Bill of Material, figure labor add in permit and work up your price.

Third, Additional work not specified above, or any change orders, will be billed as an extra on time and material.

Give the customer the best price, but make money and have fun!