Generator Question

[Dean83169]

I am installing a 14kw generator with an automatic transfer switch for the whole house. We are under the 2005 code still. I was running a 6/3 rx to it and the inspector said that i cannot use it as service entry cable. He also said he needs a calculated load for the house so that he can be sure the generator will handle the load. He said in the 2005 code it states it has to be able to handle the full load of the house. I mean if its gonna draw to much the breaker will trip.
Questions are:
1) I thought service entry cable was from the utility company.
2) If the homeowner bought the equipment, why is it I have to calculate the load, he can turn stuff off if needed, I cant make him go buy a different generator.

 

[stickboy1375]

I am installing a 14kw generator with an automatic transfer switch for the whole house. We are under the 2005 code still. I was running a 6/3 rx to it and the inspector said that i cannot use it as service entry cable. He also said he needs a calculated load for the house so that he can be sure the generator will handle the load. He said in the 2005 code it states it has to be able to handle the full load of the house. I mean if its gonna draw to much the breaker will trip.
Questions are:
1) I thought service entry cable was from the utility company.
2) If the homeowner bought the equipment, why is it I have to calculate the load, he can turn stuff off if needed, I cant make him go buy a different generator.

You need to provide a calculated load, the inspector is correct, as far as the romex is concerned, its a chapter 3 wiring method, and have done the same, except with a 14kw generator that would have a 70 amp breaker, so thats a expensive piece of NM cable...

 

[stickboy1375]

I am installing a 14kw generator with an automatic transfer switch for the whole house. We are under the 2005 code still. I was running a 6/3 rx to it and the inspector said that i cannot use it as service entry cable. He also said he needs a calculated load for the house so that he can be sure the generator will handle the load. He said in the 2005 code it states it has to be able to handle the full load of the house. I mean if its gonna draw to much the breaker will trip.
Questions are:
1) I thought service entry cable was from the utility company.
2) If the homeowner bought the equipment, why is it I have to calculate the load, he can turn stuff off if needed, I cant make him go buy a different generator.

This is why I don't get involved in jobs that a home owner supplied the material, if the calculated load is higher than the generator output, you can always do load shedding to make it code compliant...

 

[resistance]

Interesting!!! Just a thought: A portable generator with a power inlet and interlock kit gives the customer full control over which circuits they can control >>>>Whole House—if they choose. Obviously this is ridiculous, but just something to put out there. Note: i know some areas do not allow interlock kits.

 

[iwire]

Interesting!!! Just a thought: A portable generator with a power inlet and interlock kit gives the customer full control over which circuits they can control >>>>Whole House?if they choose. Obviously this is ridiculous, but just something to put out there. Note: i know some areas do not allow interlock kits.

I don't find it ridiculous at all, it gives the HO total freedom to change what he wants to power at any time.

I have set up generators like that with Interlock kits.

 

[resistance]

I don't find it ridiculous at all, it gives the HO total freedom to change what he wants to power at any time.

I have set up generators like that with Interlock kits.

Maybe I wrote it wrong. I was saying it would be ridiculous if a HO would select all available circuits (aka=wholehouse) in the panel. Yes, I see where It would seem I meant: Having freedom to select any circuit is ridiculous. I didn’t mean that. Proof reading needed by me

 

[resistance]

@iwire,
where are you at when I have a code question?? :?

 

[ceb58]

Some one please correct me, thanks to a BUDDY I don't have my 05 any more, but the load capacity requirement is not part of the 05 it came in in the 08 as 702.5 (2)(a)(b)

 

[infinity]

Some one please correct me, thanks to a BUDDY I don't have my 05 any more, but the load capacity requirement is not part of the 05 it came in in the 08 as 702.5 (2)(a)(b)

Going strictly by memory I think that you're correct. The 2005 had no such provision.

 

[ceb58]

I am installing a 14kw generator with an automatic transfer switch for the whole house. We are under the 2005 code still. I was running a 6/3 rx to it and the inspector said that i cannot use it as service entry cable. He also said he needs a calculated load for the house so that he can be sure the generator will handle the load. He said in the 2005 code it states it has to be able to handle the full load of the house. I mean if its gonna draw to much the breaker will trip.
Questions are:
1) I thought service entry cable was from the utility company.
2) If the homeowner bought the equipment, why is it I have to calculate the load, he can turn stuff off if needed, I cant make him go buy a different generator.

If you truly are still under the 05 the inspector is wrong with the load calculation part. Ask for the code reference.
The wiring from the generator will fall under Art. 225
If you took on the job then it is your responsibility to install it in a code compliant manner. There are several ways to install the unit to code. You present these options to the home owner and let them chose.

 

[goldstar]

The 2005 NEC section 702.5 Capacity and Rating states the following :

An optional standby system shall have the adequate capacity and rating for the supply of all equipment intended to be operated at one time. Optional standby system equipment shall be suitable for the maximum available fault current at its terminals. The user of the standby system shall be permitted to select the load connected to the system.

The first sentence indicates that the system (generator and xfer switch) needs to be sized in accordance with the connected load but the last sentence indicates that the user gets to decide what equipment gets connected to the system. A bit contradictory if you ask me. The problem, as I see it, comes with whatever equipment might be be energized automatically during a utility power outage (i.e A/C units). Any high power draw equipment that might be running when a power outage occurs (like a double wall oven or electric range) will, in all likelihood, default to the off position. If the homeowner wants to operate these units while on standby then they have a problem. However, if the units are old and operate with a dial instead of a touch feature then you have a problem. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[ceb58]

The 2005 NEC section 702.5 Capacity and Rating states the following : The first sentence indicates that the system (generator and xfer switch) needs to be sized in accordance with the connected load but the last sentence indicates that the user gets to decide what equipment gets connected to the system. A bit contradictory if you ask me. The problem, as I see it, comes with whatever equipment might be be energized automatically during a utility power outage (i.e A/C units). Any high power draw equipment that might be running when a power outage occurs (like a double wall oven or electric range) will, in all likelihood, default to the off position. If the homeowner wants to operate these units while on standby then they have a problem. However, if the units are old and operate with a dial instead of a touch feature then you have a problem. Just my 2 cents worth.

Look at the first sentence the word "intended". But your thinking is in line with what got the code changed in the 08 cycle.