GFCI in Laboratories

[rick hart]

Can someone tell me what an Industrial Laboratory is? Would a large medical research or pathpology lab be considered "industrial" by the CMP?

Thanks

 

[charlie b]

As far as the NEC's rules for GFCI protection, an "Industrial Laboratory" is defined as a "non-dwelling unit." See 210.8(B).

I actually do not understand the question. What does being "industrial" change, with regard to any NEC rules? :-?

 

[tom baker]

For GFCI application, if there is a sink, in any location, a recp within 6 ft must be GFCI protected under the 08 NEC.
However, I just looked this up and had to change my answer, there is an exception for "industrial labatories" GFCI protection in 08 NEC 210.8 B 5

 

[tom baker]

If you are looking for an Art 100 Def of Industrial Lab, there isn't one.
We may need to go back to the ROP and ROC and see who submitted the change and who they work for to get the intent.

 

[charlie b]

. . . there is an exception for "industrial laboratories" GFCI protection in 08 NEC 210.8 B 5

Thanks for pointing that out, Tom. I keep looking first at the 2005 edition, and did not notice that one.

I?ll change my flippant answer to offer the opinion that getting someone to agree that a medical or pathology lab is ?industrial,? in this context, is the easy part. But the exception only applies to instances in which allowing a circuit to trip (on a ground fault condition) would create a hazard that is greater than the danger of shock from that ground fault. It would be harder to justify the existence of that greater hazard, and thus harder to justify leaving out the GFCI protection.

In all the lab work I?ve done recently (all under the 2005 NEC or earlier), we have always included GFCI protection for receptacles near sinks. In one project currently underway, the code cycle of record is likely (but not certain) to change to 2008, before the final design is completed. Even if it does, I do not plan to take advantage of that exception (i.e., allowing me to leave out the GFCI for a receptacle near a sink) unless the Laboratory Planner gives me a clear and reasonable justification that the hazard would be greater with the GFCI in place.

 

[Hendrix]

Can someone tell me what an Industrial Laboratory is? Would a large medical research or pathpology lab be considered "industrial" by the CMP?

Thanks

Maybe they meant lavatory :grin:

 

[rick hart]

I can't figure out where any industrial sink would cause a greater hazard but that really isn't the question after all:

My question is based on what to do with a fairly new lab in use now. Safety folks look at the current code and say the installation is outside of code- true enough. When the Lab was built- under 93 NEC- no problem.
The specfic problem is in places where plugmold was used to provide outlets across the lab workbench and sinks and to complicate matters- shared neutrals were used in multi-circuit configuration.

So, its not that I have a problem with the GFCI protection, I have a problem pulling out and chunking several hundred feet of hospital grade plugstrip to comply with the current code. Unless the area undergoes renovation, of course. I'm good with that.

I know NEC does not apply after the fact, assuming the area met code at the time of installation. But,where do you stop with the NEC after the fact in keeping folks safe enough? Parts of the hospital were wired with AL THW in the 60's; does that need to come out too? Probably. In the grand scheme of things in a 80 year old facility, there are bigger fish to fry (no pun intended) if bringing a facility up to current code every three years is the goal. I'm starting to whine...
Thanks

 

[charlie b]

I can't figure out where any industrial sink would cause a greater hazard but that really isn't the question after all.

It?s not the sink that causes the hazard. It?s an item plugged into a receptacle that could cause a hazard if it lost power. One example might be a chemical or biological experiment for which a loss of power to a pump or a fan or a mixer or something might lead to a release of nasty stuff into the lab environment. Not a likely scenario, but the only one I can come up with for now.

My question is based on what to do with a fairly new lab in use now. Safety folks look at the current code and say the installation is outside of code- true enough. When the Lab was built- under 93 NEC- no problem.

Now I am lost. New lab, but old building, and not a result of a recent renovation? If a new Principal Investigator moves in to an old building, and is willing to work with the existing power, water, and gas services, and if you therefore do not need to do any renovations, then the NEC is not a player in the arrangements. You can upgrade the wiring, even if the NEC does not require it, if the owner (or the PI) is willing to pay the costs. But you don?t have to.

The specific problem is in places where plugmold was used to provide outlets across the lab workbench and sinks and to complicate matters- shared neutrals were used in multi-circuit configuration.

Again, I don?t understand. What is the matter with plugmold? Are you saying there is no GFCI receptacles installed along this raceway? Feel free to put one in, if you like. It shouldn?t require pulling or replacing any wiring, unless you are telling us that the present receptacles are not even grounded.

Also, shared neutrals is allowed, even under the 2008 NEC. The new requirement has to do with forcing all ungrounded conductors to lose power together, using multi-pole breakers or handle ties.

But, where do you stop with the NEC after the fact in keeping folks safe enough?

You stop when the dollars stop. It?s as simple as that. The NEC is all about a minimum standard of safety, not about absolute safety and the elimination of any possibility of any injury ever.

Parts of the hospital were wired with AL THW in the 60's; does that need to come out too? Probably.

Probably not. Why should it?

 

[weressl]

I can't figure out where any industrial sink would cause a greater hazard but that really isn't the question after all:

My question is based on what to do with a fairly new lab in use now. Safety folks look at the current code and say the installation is outside of code- true enough. When the Lab was built- under 93 NEC- no problem.
The specfic problem is in places where plugmold was used to provide outlets across the lab workbench and sinks and to complicate matters- shared neutrals were used in multi-circuit configuration.

So, its not that I have a problem with the GFCI protection, I have a problem pulling out and chunking several hundred feet of hospital grade plugstrip to comply with the current code. Unless the area undergoes renovation, of course. I'm good with that.

I know NEC does not apply after the fact, assuming the area met code at the time of installation. But,where do you stop with the NEC after the fact in keeping folks safe enough? Parts of the hospital were wired with AL THW in the 60's; does that need to come out too? Probably. In the grand scheme of things in a 80 year old facility, there are bigger fish to fry (no pun intended) if bringing a facility up to current code every three years is the goal. I'm starting to whine...
Thanks

NEC may not apply but OSHA does. OSHA is very specific what installation features MUST comply, regardless of the age of installation.

 

[Glenn Easterly]

Inspectorgadget

Inspectorgadget

After doing some research on GFCI in laboratories and found that the buck stop here is true. I'am dealing with a renovated room at a college and have water pipes extending down a wall crossing over wire mold. The customer feels that because every receptacle is grounded that should'nt be any reason to install a GFCI.
Well anyway I am glad I found your question and direction to the 08 NEC.