gfci ques ?
- Thread starter wireman1
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jimdavis
Senior Member
- Location
- salt lake city, UT USA
Is food prepared or served in this break room? If so then I would classify it as a commercial kitchen and say all receptacles are required to be GFCI protected in accordance with 210.8(B)(2).
mopowr steve
Senior Member
- Location
- NW Ohio
- Occupation
- Electrical contractor
2011Code states in 210.8(B)(2) it requires all 15 and 20 amp, 125 volt receptacles in non-dwelling kitchens to be GFCI protected whether or not they are on the counter top or not.
The 6' rule no longer applies.
The only way out, is to look at whether your break room is by definition a kitchen or not. Meaning does it have both a sink and permanent provision for cooking. Odds are probably yes (sink and microwave). So no way out.
The 6' rule no longer applies.
The only way out, is to look at whether your break room is by definition a kitchen or not. Meaning does it have both a sink and permanent provision for cooking. Odds are probably yes (sink and microwave). So no way out.
ptonsparky
Tom
- Occupation
- EC - retired
Each does not need to be a gfci, just gfci protected.
david
Senior Member
- Location
- Pennsylvania
A permanent means for cooking does not normally include a counter mounted microwave. No more than a toaster would.
- Location
- Massachusetts
Here inspectors require GFCIs in employee break rooms even with counter microwaves.
I don't believe a cord-and-plug-connected, countertop microwave qualifies as a permanent provision for cooking.
That said, I'd take the safer approach whether Code requires GFCI protection or not.
- Location
- Placerville, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Retired PV System Designer
There are some interesting recipes for cooking in a dishwasher, and that is probably permanently installed. 
readydave8
re member
- Location
- Clarkesville, Georgia
- Occupation
- electrician
Microwaves may not be present at time of final inspection, do you mean that all break rooms with sinks and counter tops must have receptacles to be GFCI?
When you say "inspectors require" is that because of their interpretation of NEC or due to local code?
- Location
- Massachusetts
In the jobs I have done with employee break rooms they expected GFCIs.
I could point out a counter microwave is not permanent and they could point out neither is a mounted one. Both will breakdown and be replaced.
mopowr steve
Senior Member
- Location
- NW Ohio
- Occupation
- Electrical contractor
Everything eventually breaks down and needs replaced:lol:.
mopowr steve
Senior Member
- Location
- NW Ohio
- Occupation
- Electrical contractor
Oh, by the way anything is permanent if used more than 90 days in the same location.
After all even a range plugs in and can be pulled out or replaced. So are they referring to a cooking appliance to be " the range". And or could it be anything that cooks anything that is in place for more than 90 days.
After all even a range plugs in and can be pulled out or replaced. So are they referring to a cooking appliance to be " the range". And or could it be anything that cooks anything that is in place for more than 90 days.
david
Senior Member
- Location
- Pennsylvania
I do not generally see a circuit called out on the plans during review for, a counter mounted microwave, and I do not usually see a dedicated space for a counter mounted microwave during inspections. I do however see ranges and other types of microwaves called out on a lot of plans.
The criteria that I would use might be to see if the design professional called the area out as a kitchen. If a break room had a sink and dedicated spaces for cooking equipment or dedicated circuits for such may also be criteria that I might use.
The criteria that I would use might be to see if the design professional called the area out as a kitchen. If a break room had a sink and dedicated spaces for cooking equipment or dedicated circuits for such may also be criteria that I might use.
mopowr steve
Senior Member
- Location
- NW Ohio
- Occupation
- Electrical contractor
Just trying to deseminate the language in code not trying to apply interpretation.
So what do you call your statement as permanent means anything used in place over 90 days, if not an interpretation? Code does not make such a distinction.
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