GFI receptacles
- Thread starter twada
- Start date
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BAHTAH
Senior Member
- Location
- United States
Re: GFI receptacles
The metal raceways can serve as grounding conductors when effectively bonded where necessary. I sounds like you have an Engineer calling out a grounding conductor to be installed in the conduit which is a common installation. You can bond the GFI ground to the metal box and meet the NEC but may not meet the job specifications if the Engineer called out the separate grounding conductor.
The metal raceways can serve as grounding conductors when effectively bonded where necessary. I sounds like you have an Engineer calling out a grounding conductor to be installed in the conduit which is a common installation. You can bond the GFI ground to the metal box and meet the NEC but may not meet the job specifications if the Engineer called out the separate grounding conductor.
flightline
Senior Member
Re: GFI receptacles
Your profile indicates that you are a consultant, and now I better understand the specific meaning in your case of the statement " We missed the ground wiring on the construction document. " If you are using a metal raceway system, or some other metal enclosed wiring method by which the metal enclosure is rated for use as an equipment grounding conductor in accordance with article 250, then I would have to say you could. Since I'm from the Chicago area, that is how most homes and business are wired. One exception would be health care situations, especially within the city of Chicago, where an insulated equipment is required, in section 18-27-517.13 (a), among other places.
Your profile indicates that you are a consultant, and now I better understand the specific meaning in your case of the statement " We missed the ground wiring on the construction document. " If you are using a metal raceway system, or some other metal enclosed wiring method by which the metal enclosure is rated for use as an equipment grounding conductor in accordance with article 250, then I would have to say you could. Since I'm from the Chicago area, that is how most homes and business are wired. One exception would be health care situations, especially within the city of Chicago, where an insulated equipment is required, in section 18-27-517.13 (a), among other places.
- Location
- Massachusetts
Re: GFI receptacles
As has been said as long as these are not in patient care areas the raceway can serve as the grounding conductor.
But when you say
If there is PVC involved you are SOL. (something out of luck).
As has been said as long as these are not in patient care areas the raceway can serve as the grounding conductor.
But when you say
My first though is to whether these are fed under ground with PVC and just the exposed part is metallic.
If there is PVC involved you are SOL. (something out of luck).
daveselectric
Member
- Location
- Ohio
Re: GFI receptacles
The construction document is part of your contract.
You are required to bond the device to the box. To have a ground wire in the conduit is another question which depends on the installation.
If not having a ground wire meets code you will need to get a change order because you are making changes to the specs. Consult with the engineer of record and have him write a change order to cover your butt.
The construction document is part of your contract.
You are required to bond the device to the box. To have a ground wire in the conduit is another question which depends on the installation.
If not having a ground wire meets code you will need to get a change order because you are making changes to the specs. Consult with the engineer of record and have him write a change order to cover your butt.
ryan_618
Senior Member
- Location
- Salt Lake City, Utah
Re: GFI receptacles
I don't have NEC my here, but I remember in the 99' it was article 210-7 and in the 2002 it is somewhere in 406 that discusses the installation of GFCI receptacles (and their slaves) with out an equipment ground, for the replacement of two-wire receptacles. I would assume that this is because the technology of a GFCI, to a certain degree, circumvents the nessecity of an equipment ground. With that in mind, would a GFCI without an equipment meet the intent of the code?
I don't have NEC my here, but I remember in the 99' it was article 210-7 and in the 2002 it is somewhere in 406 that discusses the installation of GFCI receptacles (and their slaves) with out an equipment ground, for the replacement of two-wire receptacles. I would assume that this is because the technology of a GFCI, to a certain degree, circumvents the nessecity of an equipment ground. With that in mind, would a GFCI without an equipment meet the intent of the code?
david
Senior Member
- Location
- Pennsylvania
Re: GFI receptacles
Since a GFCI is a grounding type of rec. and this is a new installation and not the replacement of a non-grounding type rec. I would say an equipment ground would be required to be bonded to the rec.
Since a GFCI is a grounding type of rec. and this is a new installation and not the replacement of a non-grounding type rec. I would say an equipment ground would be required to be bonded to the rec.
cselectric
Senior Member
- Location
- Wisconsin
Re: GFI receptacles
David,
As far as it goes, you are correct. However, 250.118 allows for EMT, RMC and IMC to be used as an EGC. As Don previously stated, this practice is pretty much SOP in the Chicago area.
David,
As far as it goes, you are correct. However, 250.118 allows for EMT, RMC and IMC to be used as an EGC. As Don previously stated, this practice is pretty much SOP in the Chicago area.
daveselectric
Member
- Location
- Ohio
Re: GFI receptacles
You are all correct. The conduit may be used as a the EGC. In health care facilities, patient care areas, a EGC must be pulled from the panel.
Some PE's will spec that there be a EGC pulled from the panel. This is the PE's spec and is part of the construction document / contract and thus is required.
You are all correct. The conduit may be used as a the EGC. In health care facilities, patient care areas, a EGC must be pulled from the panel.
Some PE's will spec that there be a EGC pulled from the panel. This is the PE's spec and is part of the construction document / contract and thus is required.
david
Senior Member
- Location
- Pennsylvania
Re: GFI receptacles
250.118 Types of Equipment Grounding Conductors.
I was referring to the conduit when I said bonded to the equipment ground. And from an inspection point of view the NEC would only require the equipment grounds present to be bonded to the rec.
I agree, when a contract asked for a certain type of equipment ground it should be installed but that additional requirement is a contract issue.
250.118 Types of Equipment Grounding Conductors.
I was referring to the conduit when I said bonded to the equipment ground. And from an inspection point of view the NEC would only require the equipment grounds present to be bonded to the rec.
I agree, when a contract asked for a certain type of equipment ground it should be installed but that additional requirement is a contract issue.
- Location
- Massachusetts
Re: GFI receptacles
So is he writing the job spec or does he need to follow them?
Bob
I also agree with this, what makes this question confusing is the original poster twada is a consultant.
So is he writing the job spec or does he need to follow them?
Bob
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