Good Inspectors v. Bad Inspectors

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77401

Banned
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South of the Border in Houston, Texas
Do you ever wonder?

What makes a good Inspector?
Thru all the years I've experienced some bad, but mostly good inspectors.
Characteristics of my favorite inspectors would be...
Friendly, not all business, will take a minute to say hello, and make some small talk. Maybe they'll get to know me personally & let me get to know them too. Some will let me have their home numbers & their pager #'s. When the inspectors takes a minute & tells me his problems with the inspection department or new Mayor with me, it makes me feel like we are friends, not competitors.
Smiles & Laughs. I am something to laugh at!(or with)
Its not whether I get a green or red tag... its the way the present it!

What makes a bad Inspector?
Ego's, its us the EC, against them.
Insecurity, not being able to speak in a professional manner explaining the violation from his point of view.
Is it that the inspector has to make a quick decision about a red or green tag, when he would rather have time to research it first? When in doubt red tag it!
Does the inspector, loose face if he calls another inspector or his boss to ask, if this particular item is or isn't a violation?
I can't help it when I see the post on the forum, asking for reassurance of an inspectors actions, or red tag, he already gave & now he's doubting his own judgement.
Inaccessible, and won't return calls.
All serious & shows me they hate their job, or is it me?
Sometimes I get a feeling, especially the newer inspectors have a God complex. They finally get to put down their tools & get a position of authority and immediately feel they have to flex their muscles.
Inspectors that never give a time for the inspection and make me wait all day for them to show. Then they show, and don't introduce themselves by name or ask me who I am. Not that it should matter who I am.
New inspectors should have a 4 year apprenticeship program too! And be forced to wear a tag that say's CHIT :p (City Housing Inspector in Training)
:twisted:
 
From your first list, it appears that a good inspector must be your friend. That's not rational, IMO.

He can be your buddy, but that's not a requirement of the job; I'd almost say that's counterproductive for all parties.

Professionalism, courtesy, knowledge, yes.

Liking me? Not required.

Work time is for work. Play time is for play.

IMO.
 
Your list tends to show how you want the inspector to keep you happy, that is not his job.

What some may tend to forget is that most inspectors are busy (lets take the rogue inspector out of this equation), and your inspection is not the only one he/she has to make.

Schedules get changed as some inspections mover faster, and some take longer than anticipated.

Some inspections are much harder, as the GC or the EC or the building owner or the home owner will give the inspector a hard time.

Some inspectors may have car problems, phone problems, etc... imagine they may be human :shock: .


There are contractors, owners, etc... that are understanding as to the problem of an inspection that requires changes, and the inspector may take the time to help the contractor... even though he is not responsible for that, and some companies forbid that kind of help.

Policy of the company they work for has been developed over the years and the inspector is held to keeping those policies.

It happens to be one of those days and mistakes are made - in my opinion, this will show just how good this inspector really is, when he is able to admit the mistake and help the job move on.
This also shows how important it is to have open communication and a cell phone or office connection open to the EC so the issue can be resolved as soon as possible. ( I used to receive 75-100 calls some days on my cell, hard to deal with, but better than listening to the answering machine).
Remember, some ECs get comfortable with the good inspectors - which means they will call before a job is installed to ask questions. They are comfortable enough to say, I haven't a clue what to do, can you assist me. My answer was always yes... even if I did not know the answer :wink:

Remember we are talking about a reasonable inspector who understands how the contractor has to deal with all angles on a job (labor, customer, insurance, payable, receivables, contractors, incidentals like the wrong delivery, flat tires, accidents - to equipment and trucks and employees, even maybe family life), not just the inspection. I used to say to the guys, we are like the referees at a football game, only necessary to keep the game honest, but not the stars - the stars are the ECs. This is part of the training I now provide to inspectors.

Yes inspectors need to be human, so do contractors!!!
 
I don't think 77401 is asking the inspector to be best buds and come over on Sunday to watch the game.

I'm thinking he wants a little of the human side of the inspector to come out. I've seen more than a few inspectors that were total jerks to people.

Simple common courtesy. Good Morning. Please. Thank You. Have a good Day. There's always a headliner in the news to chat about as you take the manlift or stairs up to the job.

I've met a lot of contractors and electricians who I would have liked to be friends with outside of work, but have chosen not to. There are to guys I have known for a long time that I have a beer with after work or we get together with the wives for dinner. That's two out of hundreds. You just need to be selective. They never ask me to compromise my integrity because of our freindship.
 
Remember, some ECs get comfortable with the good inspectors - which means they will call before a job is installed to ask questions. They are comfortable enough to say, I haven't a clue what to do, can you assist me. My answer was always yes... even if I did not know the answer
Click to expand...

Checking with the inspector, on what you believe, may be problem issues, before the job starts, is a good way to avoid conflict, and maybe get to know a little about the inspectors views on a project.
 
Hello 77401,
I am one of the new Inspectors out there (1 year) that you'd like to CHIT Tag. There is a lot in this thread Friendship, Knowledge, Code, AHJ Directives and finally personality. I have a Journeyman's License, passed the ICC Electricial Inspector's Tests and am Approved by the State of Florida. I came from the 'field' and I do know what 'it's' like.
I couldn't help but laugh that you'd consider gossip about the Building Dept or the Mayor as a sign of friendship. Age and experience will teach you that it is the kiss of death in any relationship Personal or Professional.
We can do small talk, if you wish, but try to remember my area is approx. 10 X 50 miles. I average 20 or more addresses a day & have to keep moving to avoid 'roll overs.'
There may be 50 ways to do a job right, 49 of which I might not have done it that way. I have to determine if you complied with the MINIMUM standards of the Code AND if the future OCCUPANTS will be safe. I can be held liable long after your "tail light guarantee" is over and you can't be found. It is an awesome responsibility.
I spend a good part of my personal time studying the code and on this Forum or others to become more knowledgable. 36.7% of my inspections fail on the first try. The vast majority of the time I issue a Yellow Tag with description of problem(s) & Code Articles. Fix it, call it back in and I'll come back, no fee. Expect a Red Tag (fee) if I have to give you a punch list of the 15 dangerous things YOU left in YOUR job.
I'm not afraid to pull out my Code book or call a senior Inspector on a job and ask questions. I have made a few mistakes, apologized AND learned from them. You have, or can easily get, my phone #. I get calls all the time asking me what I want. I always answer the same, "It's not me it's what the Code requires."
I've also heard that some have unjustly kicked my name around the supply shops. My usual thought is "let me get this straight, you didn't comply with the MINIMUM standards of the Code and somehow I'm a prick?"....lol. Sounds to me like the real Ego is in the supply shop. I'm just looking for compliance with NFPA 70 and other Codes. I want your job to pass inspection. If it doesn't all I get is more work.
I am lucky to work for IR County. We have weekly meetings and our AHJ always stresses Be Polite, get to know the contractors, know the Code that applies, Be a Teacher and use the Red Tag only when you have too. I like my job and the overwhelming majority of people I meet.
The posts from Georgestolz, Ryan Jackson, Pierre C Belarge, Sandsnow, Larry LeVoir and Satcom deserve to be read again and understood.

Have a Good Day!

ps... will some one please tell me what IMO stands for?
 
I re read them all! I suppose I?m really being unreasonable to expect an inspector to introduce himself? ?Hello I?m tincan44, electrical Department? You do this I will too! ?I?m 77401, owner of 77401 Electric? (with a smile) :)
You inspectors have a good turn over & change your designated areas so frequently it?s nice to put a face with the name.
Smile for petes sake, I do! After all I?m glad to be in business & supporting your career as an inspector by pulling permits. Do you not smile & treat the cashiers at Home Depot good? Do you treat the Red Lobster waitress like this too? Sure you?d like to ?act? professional, but even the most successful businessmen smile & are courteous to anyone they interact with. Smile when you give me a red tag!:lol:

Stolz, It is rational to be friends with inspectors, builders or even the honey wagon drivers.(But don?t shake hands) How is it counter productive to have a friend? :roll: I am friends with competing EC?s that advertise below me in the paper, I?m not threatened or intimidated by them, or that they can be bidding against me. We call each other & talk about jobs & prices & inspectors, just like this forum.

Pierre, I don?t expect anyone to keep me happy. Inspectors, Do your job, Yes! But realize this, If you were to continue present your self in the cold, business only, hyper focused, non friendly attitude, I?m here to inspect this & leave manner, that you are saying is acceptable because, you?re phone rings off the wall & you have a nail in your tire from my job,,,, that if you were an EC or salesman, you?d be in the food stamp line because you?d get no business or repeat customers.
As an EC, I have to make everyone happy, customers, employees, GC?s, and my family, if I want to stay in business.
Inspectors, just do your job, your salary is still the same regardless of how you present yourself on your inspections. I feel for you, really I do. Except for the benefits you get & I don?t.

Sandsnow?. he feels me?8)

Tincan, I?m glad I made you laugh, I try to put a little humor in every post, But some people don?t think Dennis Leary or Chris Rock are funny. Well, I?m no Bill Cosby that?s for sure. LOL Its OK.
IMO I think you have what it takes to be a good inspector and a friendly one too. Besides reading NFPA 70 & NEC 2005 try reading Dale Carnegie
http://www.westegg.com/unmaintained/carnegie/win-friends.html

I understand being an inspector is not for everyone, nor is being an EC. I would not swap with you inspectors for one day. I found my calling and I hope you have too. Being a small contractor/businessman is the most rewarding career I could think of, short of teaching little kids to snowboard. But one pays a little more!
You know something funny? I could put 4 Electricians, 4 Plumbers, & 4 Inspectors in the same Pub & I could tell which one is which. Could you?

The thing I like about this forum is the intelligent conversations & topics I read & participate in. Too often on a job I find myself remembering something I read or replied to on here. Hopefully one inspector will remember this post the next time he enters an inspection, not smiling, and not introducing himself. And he?ll smile, look me in the eye, and introduce himself. I?ll say??Mike Holt's Code Forum member?? :twisted:
 
Just think of it this way, he is a policeman that may have to write a violation, in order to give, equal and fair treatment, he has to do his inspection and that's it.

Just the other day, i had an inspector red sticker a job, he told the owner, i can't pass this it's back feed, and the utility can't tie in, he could have given me a call, and asked why it was that way, but he din't, instead he told the owner, to have me call him, later that day, had he called i would have explained, that the utility is using the existing feed, and when they come to reconnect, they will disconnect the so called back feed, so communication is very important in this field, and i do agree, that some inspectors, have to do a little better job, at communicating on some issues.
 
77401 said:
Stolz, It is rational to be friends with inspectors, builders or even the honey wagon drivers.
Click to expand...
I didn't say that having an inspector friend is irrational.

I said that the premise "for an inspector to be good, he must be my friend" is not rational. I know some decent electricians I can't stand to be around. Does our personality conflict directly mean that an inspector is no good?

How is it counter productive to have a friend? :roll:
Click to expand...
It's not. But having emotion vested in someone who's job is to pick your job apart for defects, is by definition a conflict of interests.

Here's a story for you. My co-worker has more experience than I do by a few years. He comes from a contractor with a different school of thought when it comes to the job. He used to do very upscale work for upscale customers, and then moved out here with no license, and started on with my company.

My company is the low bid, breeze in, breeze out, keep things moving can-do company. Get it done so it doesn't kill anybody, either by falling on heads or by electrocution. (That might sound ugly, but it's a quick way of getting the point across.)

Quite a culture shock for him. He knows perfect work, and is now observing people doing less than perfect work to gain speed.

He is now comfortable with the scenery, and has begun a campaign to pick on me every time I make a mistake, real or imagined. It doesn't matter how small or trivial the error (or difference in technique) is, he will make it known he disapproves, with a heavy load of sarcasm.

Last week, after months of needling it reached a boiling point, and we had a fight. Seperating respect and friendship and job descriptions is difficult when you embrace someone as a friend.

So, from my chair, I see the opinion you present in your posts as setting yourself up for disappointment. My apprentice's job description does not include quality control of my work, but it still led to an argument and hurt feelings.

I do have inspector friends. But I hope that for the public's sake, the scrutiny on my work doesn't evaporate because somebody doesn't want to hurt my feelings. At work, that fella's job is to pick on me. My expectations are no higher, so it works. I'm not let down, and they don't have to walk on egg shells around me, either.

Just my opinion. :)
 
Stolz
My apology for takin you out of context.

When I first started out as an EC & had my van ceiling wall papered with red tags. It never bothered me & I never took it personally. I respect inspectors for finding fault if its present. It's their job, as its mine to make the repairs.

Personality conflicts arise on every job and in most families too. You either ignore it, or fight. I'm a fighter.
My first job as an apprentice, 11 of us were sent to Honeywell, building custom control centers for refineries and power plants, indoor A/C work, clean, four 10 hour days, the best situation anyone could ask for. But all Apprentices were harrassed, treated like the dirt we were, talked down to, we had to clean the toilets & go to get the guys food for lunch & breaks. Almost a boot camp, They were weeding out the weak, several let their egos and pride get in the way, quit & went back to the bench and were soon sent out to a real job. 4 years later only two of us were left in the trade. I'm unsure if the other guy is still around as its been a few years since I seen him.
Some Ballbustin on the job is OK, as long as it stays relevant. If you dish it out you better be able to take it.

GS, I'm sure your work is quality, but it may not be Ansel Adams Photographic quality as your Hemoroid co-worker is looking for. Running romex flat, straight, with staples in a straight line, equally spaced, only matters if your taking pictures for a book. I'd fire someone for doing that type work as fast as someone who takes long breaks, lunches, or leaves early.

Seriously, this is a, for profit business. Time is directly proportional to profit. or else we'd still be soldering & taping wire splices. Wirenuts are on the verge of extinction by Wagos. But thats another thread.
L8R
 
77401 said:
I could put 4 Electricians, 4 Plumbers, & 4 Inspectors in the same Pub & I could tell which one is which. Could you?

It depends. Are they wearing work clothes? If I put 4 Electricians, 4 Plumbers, & 4 Inspectors in the same Pub could you tell which one is which?
 
dlhoule said:
...If I put 4 Electricians, 4 Plumbers, & 4 Inspectors in the same Pub could you tell which one is which?
Click to expand...

I could. The 4 guys sitting on bar stools with their butt cracks exposed are the plumbers, the 4 guys looking up at the light fixtures and commenting on the installation are the electricians, and the 4 guys with all the good looking ladies hanging around are the inspectors.
 
Bryan, LMAO. :D

Ryan, judging from the wedding band, and the callouses on your fingertips, and the 48,245 proposals submitted for the 2008, I'd say you're pulling our leg. :D

Cowboy, does that make us knuckledraggers who aren't contractors or inspectors just the "Ugly"? :D
 
georgestolz said:
Ryan, judging from the wedding band, and the callouses on your fingertips, and the 48,245 proposals submitted for the 2008, I'd say you're pulling our leg. :D
Click to expand...

Chicks dig all of that stuff. You should have seen the girls swarming over Charlie E. and I at the bar when we were talking code. We nearly had to beat them away with sticks. :D
 
That's because 680.26 sounds way more erotic than it's cracked up to be.




dizzy.gif
Code joke! Snort snort!
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