Grounded Conductor at Switch

[bphgravity]

Is there any existing code or at least submitted proposals to require a grounded (neutral) conductor at all outlets and specifically outlets for switch locations. Many aftermarket "logic" and automation devices require a grounded conductor for the switch. Many installers are substituting the equipment ground for this connection. These devices are becomming more and more popular in the residential and commercial markets. Any suggestions?

 

[iwire]

Re: Grounded Conductor at Switch

I agree with you BPH this happens a lot.

Along the same lines many wall mount occupancy sensors have no neutral lead but have a ground lead and the directions note they will not work with out the ground connection.

This always makes me wonder if they are using it as neutral and these are UL listed devices.

Anybody have some info on this?

[ March 23, 2003, 12:01 PM: Message edited by: iwire ]

 

[bennie]

Re: Grounded Conductor at Switch

Gentleman: My compliments to the participants, now involved in this forum. The degree of intelligence and interest has elevated since my last involvement.

Maybe I should stay away

This issue has been rejected due to it being a wiring design favoring one manufacturer.

When farmers used the barb wire fence as a neutral, I could see a real hazard.

Does anyone feel that the small amount of current from a solid state sensor poses a problem?

[ March 23, 2003, 12:37 PM: Message edited by: bennie ]

 

[luke warmwater]

Re: Grounded Conductor at Switch

This is a design issue. No code. We make it practice to feed switch locations and rarely 'dead-end' switches. It seems that someone always wants to add something like a ceiling fan or recessed lights to be switched from the same location as another switch.
There is one tract home contractor around here that makes it a practice to use the bare equipment grounding conductor as a grounded conductor in different situations. One is they take a 14/2 to a keyless in the garage ceiling and jump out with 14/2 to a receptacle for the garage door opener. In the switch box they put a jumper between the bare grounds and the whites, and use the black as the keyless switch leg and the white as the hot for the opener. In the light box they put the white from the switch to the black to the opener, and they put the grounds and white to the opener together. This is a violation.
The bare grounding conductor is un-insulated and is not intended to carry current(even a small amount) under normal conditions.

 

[iwire]

Re: Grounded Conductor at Switch

No, I just want to know the specifics, like if UL says it is OK to use the ground, there must be a value assigned to it. Is it 1 ma at 120 V or what, and forget about the fire hazard will I feel it if I lift the ground ahead of it.

Another thing with some motion controls is even when switched manually off on the switches front control there is enough current passing through that you can feel it, if you where to get between it and the load.

 

[bennie]

Re: Grounded Conductor at Switch

I do not know the status, or limitations, of any approval.

I do know of electronic equipment that intentionally produces current on the equipment ground conductor, such as MOV protection devices.

 

[hurk27]

Re: Grounded Conductor at Switch

Any plug in strip with transiet protection that has the little green light to let you know that there is a ground will pull current on the ground