Hardwire Eq. GFCI to copper pipe

[Cletis]

I was curious why some hardwired pieces of equiptment are required to be gfci protected (mostly pool/water related items), but not items such as water heaters, on demand heaters, stoves, etc..... A small leak to ground to cause serious injury and I"m sure has. We just had a guy around here just move in a condo and he went up to fry some eggs for breakfast and his big bare belly touched metal stove and electricuted him (someone wired it wrong H-G). A GFCI would have prevented this death in my opinion.

Thoughts ?

 

[tom baker]

The hardwired equipment is where you are in the water.
Much greater potential for shock and electrocutions at low levels of current.
This post should be in the NEC topic not the Proposals, unless you want to make a proposal for the 2020 NEC.

 

[Cletis]

Ok. If you could move it that would be wonderful. I think this is a really serious topic. I've ran into all kinds of situations (mostly water heaters) where a 2 pole gfci could have prevented some pretty good damage and I cant be the only one who has seen this. I think all stainless steel ovens should be 2 pole gfci as well

 

[ptonsparky]

IMO changes to GFCI protection would require a history of death or injury. Damage contained to a properly installed water heater could be a typical End Of Life for the element and historically show little or no evidence of danger. Much as the smoke that escapes from a CFL when it reaches EOL. I see a lot of evidence of failure that a GFCI may have limited, but it would not have prevented the failure itself.

Nothing says you may not use a GFCI on a water heater or range if you would like to. Realize that some items may have a normal leakage to ground above the 5-6 ma range of a GFCI.

 

[kwired]

I was curious why some hardwired pieces of equiptment are required to be gfci protected (mostly pool/water related items), but not items such as water heaters, on demand heaters, stoves, etc..... A small leak to ground to cause serious injury and I"m sure has. We just had a guy around here just move in a condo and he went up to fry some eggs for breakfast and his big bare belly touched metal stove and electricuted him (someone wired it wrong H-G). A GFCI would have prevented this death in my opinion.

Thoughts ?

A couple things come to my mind here.

How long had this "stove" been connected incorrectly? Can you give us more details of what was incorrect? If someone had reversed H-G on a 120 volt supply, you would have energized the frame but provided no voltage to electric components and they wouldn't function. That would be typical for a gas stove, for an electric range operating at 120/240 volts, things may work, but you will potentially see 240 volts applied to any 120 volt equipment like clocks, oven lights, etc. or for 240 volt elements only 120 volts is supplied to them making them only put out about 25% of normal heat capacity. You would think someone would notice either of those conditions and wonder if something was wrong there. The user also had to be in contact with a second grounded object to get a shock.

As others have mentioned, we could GFCI everything and reduce a lot of potential risk. GFCI would not have tripped because of the reversed leads to this stove though. It would have tripped once more then 4-6 mA was leaking to anything besides a monitored conductor of the protected circuit. This may mean the man in question still gets a good jolt, but it is very likely the GFCI responds fast enough to maybe save his life.