How to price a total redo

[CRS]

I am inquiring about doing a two story 3100 sq ft knob and tube, plaster walls building in CT. There are 3 apartments and there are no common hall ways. The electrical will totally be redone. Anybody have any experience in these jobs? About where should we be coming in at or should this be a t&m deal?

Thanks

 

[mdshunk]

Hey, lacking your own historical data, it's T&M if you can get it that way. If you've never done this sort of work, you're in for an eye opening experience. It's hard for one of us to advise on time matters on this, since the degree of difficulty multiplier is usually a visceral feeling you get by touring the actual job before you prepare the estimate, based upon previous experience. If it's an apartment house, lead safe work practices will likely be a matter of concern, and you should charge appropriately.

 

[satcom]

Will you be working with open frame construction? after the GC removes all the lath and plaster.

We go a large number of k&T retro jobs, as Marc said, a walk thru the site sure helps you with the numbers.

Trade schedules, will also affect the cost.

100% of the retro jobs like this, we do, are contract priced, if you put a T&M price out there, they will still want a final price. In my state it is illegal to do a job over $500 for T&M all jobs over this amount must have a signed written contract, with the total contract amount in writting.

Take your time, look the job over, and work up an estimate, you don't want to be a day labor electrician, or you would not be in the contracting business.

 

[satcom]

Hey, lacking your own historical data, it's T&M if you can get it that way. If you've never done this sort of work, you're in for an eye opening experience.

Marc,

If more guys had historical job data, they would find estimating an easy task.

 

[mdshunk]

Marc,

If more guys had historical job data, they would find estimating an easy task.

Right... what I find is that many people don't even bother to track it. Even worse, when thy're done with a job, they often don't do any checking to see if they even made the amount of money they thought they would. Tracking productivity for a variety of jobs can take years, but that's the golden information you need to track. This same job could be bid like new work if the place was stripped. If there's to be no plaster damage, you could spend months at this place. If they'll take a bit of plaster damage here and there, then maybe somewhere in the middle. There's really no way to say from the keyboard. You really gotta go to the place, examine the construction, and imagine the paths for the home runs and imagine how you'll be fishing to each device location. Every building presents its own special set of challenges. An accurate bid on a building like this where most or all of the plaster will remain would be based on analyzing each and every device location, and what the path will be to feed it, and how long you thing it would take to get wire fished along that path.

 

[ceknight]

.....An accurate bid on a building like this where most or all of the plaster will remain would be based on analyzing each and every device location, and what the path will be to feed it, and how long you thing it would take to get wire fished along that path.

That's exactly right. Read Marc's post twice.

If you don't have the experience and historical data, you need to do a lot of poking around before you can even be somewhat sure of your bid -- get up in the attic and pull some floorboards to see what's under them. Pull a few kitchen and dining room overhead lamps to make sure there are no gas lines stubbed into the pans. Find the plumbing wall and see if it's vertical from the attic to the basement (they aren't always...). Etc.

Going vertical can save a lot of plaster: you can rewire almost all of the 2nd floor from the attic, and almost all of the 1st floor recepts from the basement. Fishing the first floor overheads is where the skill and experience really comes into play, if you don't bid that part right you're in for heartburn.

Good luck.

 

[Oakey]

When I do a K&T remodel I always pull up the attic floor to see if that darned blown in insulation is in there . Adds a lot of extra time and its most likely in the walls.

 

[Brady Electric]

How to price a total redo

I do this all the time and it is one of my specialities but I have thirty five years experience. It take time to do these jobs. Pricing this job is the easy part.
I think you should not take this job because of lack of experience. I can backfire on you. It would be good to get someone that has experience to help you so you could learn. You have to start somewhere.
The electrical field is a big one. Some electricians do nothing but new house wiring, pull wire, commercial, old house wiring and so on. You have to know your limitations and know when to hold them or fold them.
There is a reason you have to be an apprentice for three years before taking the electrical test here in N.C.
Also what Marc said you need to check out city or county regulations, the code changes on what the use is going to be. Semper Fi