I need some input

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hardworkingstiff

Senior Member
Location
Wilmington, NC
Here is the situation.

Conductors are sized using 400.5(B) for W cable feeding power pedestals on floating docks. This has been SOP for years with no problem. The local AHJ does not require engineered drawings.

Now that I have a better understanding of 110.14(C)(1) I know that because of termination limitations, this is not exactly correct (using 400.5(B)).

The load at each power center is (2) 50-amp receptacles with individual meters. So according to 555.12 the calcs are 2*50=100*.9=90.

#4 W (table 400.5(B) at 75C, 2CCC) is rated for 115-amps. #4 (table 316, 75C) is rated for 85-amps. So according to 110.14(C)(1) the #4 is too small.

I really don't have a problem in wiring these power centers with the #4 since it's been done this way for many years with no problems.

The NEC is known to be conservitive on wire ampacities and history says there is no problem. To increase the W cable will cost me the job, so it's do it this way or let someone else do it. The AHJ will not stop it (but I believe it to be because of ignorance). I've been told (by an Electrical Inspector) the strictest local AHJ has turned a blind eye to this for years, but now that's it's spelled out they may start enforcing it.

Here is the input part, if I do this job, am I being too lax?
 
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nakulak

Senior Member
are you giving quote ? if so, quote it both ways and give the owner the opportunity to choose. why hang your own butt out to dry when its not your call ? once you get the job, if the ahj says its gotta be this or that, then that's just the way its gonna be. (jmshio)
 

hardworkingstiff

Senior Member
Location
Wilmington, NC
are you giving quote ?


Not really, it's one that I quoted last Feb. that is just getting going and I quoted it back then not understanding 110.14(C)(1), so using the #4.

IMO, I have a problem that 400.5(B) ampacities can't be used at the 75C rating because of termination limitations of 110.14(C)(1). I have to wonder if 110.14(C)(1) exists because of testing or because of the lack of testing?

Edit: This comment from member pertersonra
There is a fair amount of slop built into the NEC. A lot of what is allowed is pretty conservative.
http://forums.mikeholt.com/showpost.php?p=1137564&postcount=12
 
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augie47

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Tennessee
Occupation
State Electrical Inspector (Retired)
It took a minute but I understand your reference. I am not convinced you have a problem. I see the reference to 310.16 in 110.14(C), but from the exceptions I would think as long as your wire (cable) is used at it's 75? C rating and the terminations are 75? all would be fine.
I very well could be mistaken, but, had I inspected the job it would have passed.
 

hardworkingstiff

Senior Member
Location
Wilmington, NC
It took a minute but I understand your reference. I am not convinced you have a problem. I see the reference to 310.16 in 110.14(C), but from the exceptions I would think as long as your wire (cable) is used at it's 75? C rating and the terminations are 75? all would be fine.
I very well could be mistaken, but, had I inspected the job it would have passed.

Thanks Augie.
 
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