Installation of Portable Spa

[stodd783]

***NOTE*** I am not an electrician and will not be running any of my own wiring related to this post. I am only looking for educated interpretations of the electric code and or opinions that may help me when selecting a contractor.

I recently purchased a portable spa (87"x87"x38") and am getting ready to start checking on contractors to run the circuit for it. However, the manufacture made several claims that I was unsure of.

1. They claim that the spa requires 6/3 wire with a ground (4 Wires) and that if this is used, then the spa does not have to have it's on grounding rod. I guess, based on their claim, the spa would be grounded back to the main service panel?

2. They say that their spas have a "built in" GFCI (It is printed on the contract) and that no other GFCI is required and will actually interfere with the inline one already installed in the unit.

3. They also claim that a service disconnect (emergency switch) is NOT required. I found a posting online from the NFPA that states:

"IV Spas and Hot Tubs680.40 General. Electrical installations at spas and hot tubs shall comply with the provisions of Part I and Part IV.680.41 Emergency Switch for Spas and Hot Tubs.A clearly labeled emergency shutoff or control switch for the purpose of stopping the motor(s) that provide power to the recirculation system and jet system shall be installed at a point readily accessible to the users and not less than 1.5 m (5 ft) away, adjacent to, and within sight of the spa or hot tub. This requirement shall not apply to single-family dwellings."

If this posting is quoting code, then I guess the manufacture is correct, but wouldn't it be safer to have the switch, than to not have the switch?

These three claims could save and / or cost me significantly more, but I would like some independent opinions before pricing this job.

If it makes any difference, I checked my local town ordinance and they are using the 2002 version of the NEC (and the 1985 version of the "Uniform Swimming Pool, Spa and Hot Tub Code").

I plan on having the spa placed on my patio, which is concrete (4") and I live in North Texas.

Any opinions would be greatly appreciated.

 

[jwelectric]

Re: Installation of Portable Spa

110.3 (B) Installation and Use. Listed or labeled equipment shall be installed and used in accordance with any instructions included in the listing or labeling.

680.44 (A) Listed Units. If so marked, a listed self-contained unit or listed packaged equipment assembly that includes integral ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for all electrical parts within the unit or assembly (pumps, air blowers, heaters, lights, controls, sanitizer generators, wiring, and so forth) shall be permitted without additional GFCI protection.

680.41 Emergency Switch for Spas and Hot Tubs.
A clearly labeled emergency shutoff or control switch for the purpose of stopping the motor(s) that provide power to the recirculation system and jet system shall be installed at a point readily accessible to the users and not less than 1.5 m (5 ft) away, adjacent to, and within sight of the spa or hot tub. This requirement shall not apply to single-family dwellings.

Here are the sections of the NEC that you have asked about.

Let me add that if this tub is going to be installed on the outside there is something else that needs attention:

680.42 Outdoor Installations.
A spa or hot tub installed outdoors shall comply with the provisions of Parts I and II of this article, except as permitted in 680.42(A) and (B), that would otherwise apply to pools installed outdoors.

680.21 Motors.
(A) Wiring Methods.
(1) General. The branch circuits for pool-associated motors shall be installed in rigid metal conduit, intermediate metal conduit, rigid nonmetallic conduit, or Type MC cable listed for the location. Other wiring methods and materials shall be permitted in specific locations or applications as covered in this section. Any wiring method employed shall contain a copper equipment grounding conductor sized in accordance with 250.122 but not smaller than 12 AWG.

(4) One-Family Dwellings. In the interior of one-family dwellings, or in the interior of accessory buildings associated with a one-family dwelling, any of the wiring methods recognized in Chapter 3 of this Code shall be permitted that comply with the provisions of this paragraph. Where run in a raceway, the equipment grounding conductor shall be insulated. Where run in a cable assembly, the equipment grounding conductor shall be permitted to be uninsulated, but it shall be enclosed within the outer sheath of the cable assembly.

 

[charlie b]

Re: Installation of Portable Spa

A spa is not a "building." It does not need a ground rod of its own. You are correct in saying the equipment will be grounded back to the main panel. I can't comment on the size of the wire (6/3) without knowing what amps the equipment will draw. But if that is what the manufacturer says (not the salesman, the manufacturer), then it should be right.

You don't need a separate GFCI for the spa, if it has its own. But I don't think it likely that having two in series would interfere with each other. It's like having two alarm clocks set to go off within a few seconds of each other. You really only need one, and the two will operate independently.

As I read it, you don't "need" a disconnecting means in the vicinity of the spa. But I think it is a good idea to have one. The house I am renting has a hot tub. If I had to turn it off in an "emergency," I would either have to jump over a fence (to where the equipment is located) or run around the back of the house, into the side door, and turn it off at the main panel. Not convenient for an "emergency."

 

[stodd783]

Re: Installation of Portable Spa

Ok.

It appears that there is no need for another GFCI, since they have one built in to the self contained unit. It also appears that a disconnect is NOT required, but is a good idea, so I think I'll spend the money for that.

There is disagreement about whether a separate grounding rod is required for the spa. The manufacturer calls for a 50 amp circuit, using 6/3 wire with a ground. I am hoping the code will allow my electrician to run the wire from my main panel in the garage, through the attic and down the inside of the wall and then just mount the disconnect box on the brick outside. I was trying to plan for this when we had the house built, so I ran conduit in both walls that will allow access to the panel and to the exterior wall (the builder charged way to much to run the circuit while building the house). The wire distance (panel to disconnect) will be right around 100' or so.

I don't know anything about the conduit requirements, other than to say that I won't use any electrician who tells me I don't need conduit on exposed wires outside on my patio. I'm pretty sure that no conduit is required for any wires running inside of the house?

I forgot to mention that i bought this spa directly from the manufacturer. I'm sure they are not going to recommend anything that will hurt the spa or void the warranty, but they did clearly state that they are not electricians, which is why I'm talking to you guys to make sure I know what to look for in the estimates I get.

Any other opinions or interpretations of code regarding conduit requirements or the need for a separate grounding rod at the site of the spa?

[ October 21, 2005, 09:13 PM: Message edited by: stodd783 ]

 

[oreelect]

Re: Installation of Portable Spa

680.42 shall comply with Part I & II of this article.
Part I. 680.12 Maintenance disconnecting means shall be provided.

680.22(1)(3) also required general use GFCI receptacle between 10 & 20 feet.

 

[jwelectric]

Re: Installation of Portable Spa

680.26 bonding grid to be installed

 

[suemarkp]

Re: Installation of Portable Spa

Originally posted by oreelect:
Part I. 680.12 Maintenance disconnecting means shall be provided.

Note that maintenance disconnect and emergency disconnect aren't the same thing. You need a maintenance disconnect, but don't have to have the big sign on it and the location requirements are less restrictive.

 

[electricmanscott]

Re: Installation of Portable Spa

Originally posted by stodd783:

There is disagreement about whether a separate grounding rod is required for the spa.

There should be no disagreement with anybody that uses the NEC. No ground rod required or needed.

Now for my personal opinion.

Why don't you just have a few electricians come out and look at the job. Let them tell you what needs to be done rather than you telling them. Find one you are comfortable with and let then do their job. There is nothing worse than an untrained person telling you what needs to be done when in reality they have no idea. Don't believe everything you read on the Internet.

 

[stodd783]

Re: Installation of Portable Spa

Originally posted by electricmanscott:

There should be no disagreement with anybody that uses the NEC. No ground rod required or needed.

Now for my personal opinion.

Why don't you just have a few electricians come out and look at the job. Let them tell you what needs to be done rather than you telling them. Find one you are comfortable with and let then do their job. There is nothing worse than an untrained person telling you what needs to be done when in reality they have no idea. Don't believe everything you read on the Internet.

I have no intentions of telling any electricians what I need or do not need. However, there are differing interpretations of the NEC expressed in this forum by what appear to be mostly qualified people. I fully expect that I will get different estimates of what is and is not required from the contractors that I get estimates from. I just wanted to be a little more educated when that happens.

Thanks for all who have responded with helpful comments and opinions. And thanks for your opinion also electricmanscott.