interpreting the NEC

[kevinware]

What is the "Key" to interpreting the NEC? Sometimes I feel like I am trying to crack an Egyptian code. Is there a step-by-step process (a check list or something) that all you 20 year veterans use over and over again when working through a particular situation? I read the NEC every day, but I feel like the information is scattered around in my head and I can't get it organized. Please help me with your input...............

Thanks,
Kevin

 

[iwire]

Re: interpreting the NEC

Kevin some people think I am sharp with the NEC however that is not necessarily true.

I do not feel many people can actually memorize the NEC, in my opinion what you do need to learn is how the NEC is organized.

Look at the table of contents and think about the question you want an answer to.

Is the question about one specific method, then look in that specific Article.

Is the question of a more general nature, take a look in Article 300 Wiring Methods.

This may sound oversimplified but 99% of the time I find my answerers through the use of the Table of contents.

 

[bphgravity]

Re: interpreting the NEC

Are you trying to learn a better way to navigate the NEC or interpreting the NEC?

I agree with Bob that the Table of Contents is just about the most practical and efficient way to naviagate the NEC. There is almost no point to memorizing one particular code or section. I have found that knowing where to find sections and code is much more valuable than knowing the actual code itself.

As far as interpreting the code goes, the most important thing to realize is the scope and purpose of the NEC. Article 90 gives a basic idea on how to intrepet the rest of the document. Review that Article throughly. Remembering that each section is either a permissive or resistrictive code helps you to understand the intent of each section, but do realize the code must tell you something is not permitted or it is okay. For the longest time, I was under the impression the NEC had to tell me what is permitted before it was allowed. That backwards thinking will usually not get you in trouble, but it does not allow for complete understanding of the code in whole.

 

[roger]

Re: interpreting the NEC

I agree with Bob and Bryan whole heartedly.

Bob,

This may sound oversimplified

I think it is good advice.

Kevin, books on understanding the code by Mike Holt, Tom Henry, Jade Learning, James Stallcup, and others can also be a big help.

BTW, I'm one of those who think Bob is pretty sharp on the NEC.

Roger

[ June 21, 2005, 05:04 PM: Message edited by: roger ]

 

[luckyshadow]

Re: interpreting the NEC

What I tell my apprentices to do is to think about what you want to find out in the code. Then try and come up with the "key" word or phrase. Then I use the index in the back of the book.
Some people use the table of contents some use the index. There is no right or wrong way just personnel preference. I was taught index. iwire was taught table of contents.
When trying to "learn" the NEC try and stick with a certain subject, when you are comfortable move to another. I teach my apprentices,that a good way to become familiar with it, is to think about what they are doing on the job. Then look it up and read about it. I find this makes it more realistic sort of like "hands on"

 

[physis]

Re: interpreting the NEC

It my opinion the only way to understand it better is to use it more. My biggest problem was that I couldn't predict whether a section was all I needed to know or if there were other sections that had to be understood along with it. After you've spent enough time with different sections you'll get an idea of how sections do or don't modify each other.

I really don't know of a step by step method aside from maybe regularly reading an article or two. It's the kind of book you have to get used to.

And I like the index for looking things up. I think Bob's wierd cause he's a table of contents man.

Edit: I left a word out.

[ June 21, 2005, 09:17 PM: Message edited by: physis ]

 

[George Stolz]

Re: interpreting the NEC

Originally posted by iwire:
Kevin some people think I am sharp with the NEC however that is not necessarily true.

The statement "Man has walked on the moon" is not necessarily true, but is verifiable by numerous sources.

Use either the Table of Contents or the Index. I'm an index guy, but I rarely have to use it because I have key Articles and section locations committed to memory.

Hang around here and answer questions. Look up references when discussions erupt. You'll be amazed at how fast you become good at finding code.

If interpretation is what you want, cross your eyes, read it backwards, while listening to The Mamas & The Papas. It will all come together.

 

[luckyshadow]

Re: interpreting the NEC

I thought it was cross your eyes , read it and listen to the mamas and the papas backwards

 

[physis]

Re: interpreting the NEC

I also think it's easier to remember things when you read with a particular goal in mind, a particular question for example, as opposed to reading randomly.

The NEC has a way of not becomeing clearer just by reading alone.

 

[william runkle]

Re: interpreting the NEC

The original post went to us 20 + years vets we all need to use the table of contents and index to negotiate through the new codes. Ask us old ones about boxes and without thinking go to article 370 and guess what we find Cablebus. My first code book I could almost fit in my back pocket I was a lot younger and a smller rear end. But if you want to interpret the code you might want to start with the handbook and there is a lot of other material out there to help I haven't seen them in 20 years but Wing Publishing use to put out 4 books 1 is Criss-Cross to the Code, 2 Interpretations of the Code, 3 Useful Formulas for the Electrician and 4 400 Practice Questions for Electrical Testing. So just interpret 90.1 (C) Intention This Code is not intended as a design specification or an instruction manual for untrained persons. I am not saying you are untrained from your post you sound young and enthusiastic into this trade so keep it up still read the code and use all the other resources out there. Good luck you sound like you'll make a good Electrician.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

Re: interpreting the NEC

Mamas and Papas... ???

LOL, I see I'm with my peers!

LMAO!!!

Oh yea, don't forget your glasses.

 

[physis]

Re: interpreting the NEC

So just interpret 90.1 (C) Intention This Code is not intended as a design specification or an instruction manual for untrained persons.

I have to say that I think that this is about the most useless verbage in the entire NEC.

What is it? An excuse? Obviously the burden of understanding the NEC falls on the reader.

I don't like the idea that the reader is blamed for how difficult it can be to use the NEC. That blame belongs to the writers.

Edit: Well, at least some of it does.

[ June 22, 2005, 12:04 AM: Message edited by: physis ]

 

[william runkle]

Re: interpreting the NEC

Just reading and rereading the code will not do it yes you can be able to stated word for word but you will not understand a bit of it unless you use other materials to relate to it such as the NEC Handbook It will be the closest thing to hands on. But try this experiment get a new apprentice give him the code and read it all and under supervision without telling him what to do let him rough wire a house, If he has a question tell him to look it up in the code book. This is the reason the reason for article 90.1(C). Once took a class on residential wiring with a real good text book based off the 1981 code yes a long time ago but the instructor didn't think the text was good when he started the class and used the saying just read the code it is all in the code well one chapter was on services and this house had a 200 amp service wired with 2/0 THW copper and the instructor said that is a lie a misprint you can not do that it has to be 3/0 THW copper and went on a tangent, so I said it is in the code 310-15(B)(6) table, and I said it said so in the text. The point is it isn't a training manual it is wiring laws, just like the student who wants to drive we do not give that person the statues on driving alone a say this is how you drive and after you read it you can practice driving under supervision for a certain length of time and you then can take a test and if you pass you get a license to drive. How safe of a driver is that? Again you need more than just the code book other outside material and or a code class not an update but all the code.

 

[George Stolz]

Re: interpreting the NEC

Originally posted by william runkle:
The point is it isn't a training manual it is wiring laws, just like the student who wants to drive we do not give that person the statues on driving alone a say this is how you drive and after you read it you can practice driving under supervision for a certain length of time and you then can take a test and if you pass you get a license to drive.

Good analogy!

 

[wirenut1980]

Re: interpreting the NEC

I find interpreting the code to be easier if I understand the intent of the section. Just thinking about what does it say does not cut it sometimes, but when you start thinking why was this section written. But the intent can be difficult to understand sometimes. The intent is what many of the long discussions here can be attributed to.

 

[petersonra]

Re: interpreting the NEC

Dave has a good point about trying to understand the intent of a particular section. That's not easy as intent is not often codified.

I have not found a better way than using the index and TOC, although sometimes I use the PDF version and the search utility for key words. Often this comes up with way too many hits to be usefull, but many times it is quicker than using the TOC or index, especially in the pdf version.

 

[derf48]

Re: interpreting the NEC

To understand the code and interpret it is a lifelong journey!! A few baby steps I would suggest are start at the beginning and study articles 90 and 100. Do not read them, disect them and slow down. Use the handbook for insight on what the text is really talking about, try to relate it to your everyday work, read this forum for more insight, and then start to LISTEN to your journeyman, your inspector, etc to figure out who you know would be a good mentor. Is that person knowledgable or opinionated, is his opinion based on fact, the NEC, or that is the whay he was taught, can he communicate his knowledge to you, etc. Select a mentor wisely and use him often.

When studying the code, article 100 is the most important because if you don't understand what a word actually means in the text you will never be able to grasp that particular section. The simplest example of that is the difference between outlet and receptacle in the code and in the field.

Good luck, use you patience and persistance, and don't be afraid in making a mistake as that is the most effective way of learning.

Fred Bender

 

[kevinware]

Re: interpreting the NEC

I want to thank everyone here for their input, I find it all very valuable. I just installed my tabs in my new 2005 code book and I can't wait to dive in. Again thanks, I can spend hours on this site reading this form. Maybe one day I too could be a moderator............Count on it.

Kevin

 

[marinesgt0411]

Re: interpreting the NEC

I have always been told that the only stupid question is the one not asked and if you do not understand the answer ask another question or ask it again

 

[electricmanscott]

Re: interpreting the NEC

I actually have the whole book memorized as a song. Works great! A little trick I learned from Richie, Ralph, and Potsie, back in my our school years.