What is your guys experience with doing solo commercial only work. Is it doable to schedule enough work to keep busy. I know a lot of time will be spent administratively. My thought was to aim for 3 or so 40-50k jobs a year. Is that feasible?
Is commercial only viable
- Thread starter Pinnie
- Start date
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
Projects with 40-50k in profit?
I ask because if that is your total billed to client, you aren't making much if that is all you do in a year. Materials alone might be around that much on some rather simple projects.
That was billed. I have not sat and crunched then numbers. This is kind of me doing that. My thought is trying to at least make 48k take home to match my current salary. Low end that would be 120k billed. With me paying myself labor I figure that would be close.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
So this is a separate venture on top of your primary job when it comes to what you earn? That might not be such a bad thing. If it is your primary income I wouldn't think 3 or 4 jobs per year with total billing of 40-50k would result in a reasonable income for you, especially if you are providing all the materials for the projects.
I’m sorry I could’ve said that clearer. I meant 3 jobs around 40-50k each. Totaling 120k-150k billed. That’s a scary number for me to think about so I hope that’s reasonable to expect a take home of around 50k.
James L
Senior Member
- Location
- Kansas Cty, Mo, USA
- Occupation
- Electrician
I don't think that's really feasible, but it can depend on what type of jobs. I've done jobs in that range, and the time frame for total completion was never long enough for one electrician to keep up.
One was a restaurant remodel with a 7-week completion schedule. I spent something like $12k-14k on materials and the total billed was $52k
I ended up hiring Tradesmen International to send out two guys for three weeks, which was budget friendly
Overall, I would not do it again
Was the issue not having cash to float the time until the payment?
Edit: I misread you initially. So labor was the issue.
James L
Senior Member
- Location
- Kansas Cty, Mo, USA
- Occupation
- Electrician
not enough time for one person to do all the work
They had a 7-week schedule, but I needed 8-9 weeks by myself
And you were busting your hump big time?
James L
Senior Member
- Location
- Kansas Cty, Mo, USA
- Occupation
- Electrician
I would have been. It was an existing restaurant-ish space, with a new restaurant tenant. I was told all the lighting would stay, and only add kitchen specifics. It was an ongoing customer, I didn't get prints and bid
When I showed up, I saw they were adding a whole kitchen as well as revamping the old one, as well as all new lighting and a service upgrade
I knew I had no chance to get it done solo in their time frame, so within the first week had two more guys. I had them for two weeks, then a week without them, then two more with them.
All that to just say that a commercial job in that $50k range probably won't have a calendar that's suitable for solo electrician.
I've done well with jobs in the $25-30k range, more like offices, small retail, etc
How was price negotiated?
Thank you that’s very helpful. I’ll consider more jobs as a lower price. (4 or 5 jobs in the 25-30k range.) Less risk as well.
James L
Senior Member
- Location
- Kansas Cty, Mo, USA
- Occupation
- Electrician
It was a developing scope of work, with lots of additions, and fixture selections were made along the way, etc
I billed him $10k per week starting at week 2 with the understanding that I wouldn't give him any quotes until the entirety of the scope of work was settled
In week 5 I submitted a final price and remaining payment schedule
That's nowhere near typical
Yeah that wouldn’t be my scenarios. I would see the scope of work and timeframe up front. Now gauging what I can do in the time allotted is still a challenge. I’ve never been good at knowing how long something will take me. I guess that’s where labor hours could help.
readydave8
re member
- Location
- Clarkesville, Georgia
- Occupation
- electrician
Do you get any benefits not included in the $48k?
If nothing else, probably 1/2 social security
PTO and truck are probably the biggest things. As far as social security when you are self employed and pay self employment tax, self-employed you pay the full fifteen point three percent self-employment tax, but you deduct half of it as a business expense, so your net cost ends up matching what you’d owe with an employer splitting the bill. It just feels heavier upfront since it’s all coming from your pocket.
Strathead
Senior Member
- Location
- Ocala, Florida, USA
- Occupation
- Electrician/Estimator/Project Manager/Superintendent
Purely my opinion with no statistical evidence. $120,000 gross per year is not going to yield you with 50- 60 living income. In commercial the project doesn't revolve around the electrician and you aren't likely to be able to maintain schedules on all jobs with only one person. (not I didn't say ANY job, just all jobs.)
Purely because of the time schedule or are you saying margin wise? What would you expect on 120k?
Yeah its likely I’ll need to find a helper part time. I think my dad could use some side money.
Strathead
Senior Member
- Location
- Ocala, Florida, USA
- Occupation
- Electrician/Estimator/Project Manager/Superintendent
Margin wise. Part of this is about accounting, etc. but lets say you are going to maximize your ability to write off what you can to minimize your tax burden. That is surely, your truck and all of its maintenance, your lunches 5 days a week, At your size I will assume a portion of your house as an office, along with office expenses, phone, computer, software, printer, etc. I would be surprised if you show an actual profit/wage of $50,000 a year. I would think 30% would be pretty good. That is because you would be paying yourself a wage. I expect labor to be between 30% and 40% of the total job cost. And all the overhead is going to likely be 20% which is on top of the job cost. So, 80% of 120,000 is 96,000. Your wage it 30% of that or $28,800. So the other 12 to 22,000 you are looking for would need to come out of overbudgeted material, quicker work, less overhead, etc. That which you couldn't count on.
Lastly, how big of a job do you think $50,000 is going to buy you in Ohio today? Lets do it this way. Figure $70 for one worker including labor burden. and 50% of job cost being labor. 80% of 50,000 takes care of overhead giving you $40,000, 50% of which is labor. $20,000/70= 285 hours. There are approximately 2,000 work hours in a year. That should give you some ideas to start thinking. Remember every single number I just gave you, I pulled out of my butt. I don't think you are going to have an error margin as great as 20% in my figuring though.
James L
Senior Member
- Location
- Kansas Cty, Mo, USA
- Occupation
- Electrician
@Strathead put some good stuff together.
In the aforementioned restaurant job I did (which was several years ago, maybe 2019) I was on the job part time because I was teaching (mornings) at my son's school that year.
After all expenses I made $21,000 in the 7 weeks I was tied up there.
In the aforementioned restaurant job I did (which was several years ago, maybe 2019) I was on the job part time because I was teaching (mornings) at my son's school that year.
After all expenses I made $21,000 in the 7 weeks I was tied up there.