Is there a difference between TVSS's and a "Line Condioner"?

[sw_ross]

I have a customer that has a store with a moderate amount of display lighting, track and lay-in fluorescent. The tracks are setup with line voltage heads, and he as an assortment of LED, CFL, and halogen screw-ins.

He claims that he goes through lamps/bulbs way faster than he thinks he should be, even the LED's.

Someone was telling him about needing a "line conditioner".
Everything is single phase. The same poco transformer also feeds a bar/restaraunt next door.
The owner of the bar hasn't complained to me about similar issues.

Can someone educate me about the difference between a TVSS and a "line conditioner"?

 

[sw_ross]

ETA: sometimes the LED's will start flashing

ETA: sometimes the LED's will start flashing

Also, he did mention that he's had a time or two where the LED bulbs start strobing...?

 

[ron]

A surge protection device has standards that you can find UL listings and ratings for that make it more realistic to compare apples and apples.

Line conditioners are more often smoke and mirrors. Sometimes actual smoke comes out.

There are lots of variations of line conditioners such as transformers, or reactors, or filters, or UPSs, or ........

 

[sw_ross]

My first thought is to focus on connections, starting at the panel through the branch circuits with a focus on loose neutrals.

 

[petersonra]

I have a customer that has a store with a moderate amount of display lighting, track and lay-in fluorescent. The tracks are setup with line voltage heads, and he as an assortment of LED, CFL, and halogen screw-ins.

He claims that he goes through lamps/bulbs way faster than he thinks he should be, even the LED's.

Someone was telling him about needing a "line conditioner".
Everything is single phase. The same poco transformer also feeds a bar/restaraunt next door.
The owner of the bar hasn't complained to me about similar issues.

Can someone educate me about the difference between a TVSS and a "line conditioner"?

I would be looking to quantify how frequent his losses are. A lot of CFL bulbs are just junk as are a lot of LED bulbs. Halogen bulbs can get really hot and fail.

I also agree with the poster who suggested looking for loose neutrals. I'd be inclined to come in some time when the place is closed and put a very heavy load on L1-N and then on L2-N at different spots in the place and see what the L1-N and L2-N voltages do. If they don't change you probably don't have any loose neutrals to worry about. If they shift a bunch you probably have one or more loose ones.

 

[sw_ross]

Additionally, what are your thoughts about a line voltage track head with a screw in LED lamp vs a track head that is LED?
Pros and cons...

Thanks!

 

[Jraef]

TVSS (Transient Voltage Surge Suppressor) is a term that has been officially superseded by the term "Surge Protection Device" or SPD. Same thing, but when you go to buy one it will make a difference in your success in finding it. An SPD is intended to protect ONLY against a rapid and high SURGE or SPIKE in line voltage. So if that's not your problem, it isn't going to help.

The term "Line Conditioner" used to have value, but has unfortunately been usurped by a lot of scammy internet con artists, so you have to be careful. Originally, a "Line Conditioner" was a transformer with an automatic tap changer or similar device that would measure and react to line voltage swings, up or down, to give a steady (or more steady) voltage to your load. They were often combined WITH an SPD as well. But because it was never an "officially" defined term, now you can get scammed into buying expensive capacitors in fancy boxes, or magical mystical boxes that "make your electrons spin correctly" (yes, that's an actual marketing claim!). So buyer beware. Legitimate power line conditioners can have benefits, IF you have a power quality problem coming in from the outside.

But before spending ANY money on these things, I agree with the concept of eliminating the more obvious issues. If the next door neighbor is not seeing the same issues, it's much MUCH more likely to be a premise wiring issue.

 

[Jraef]

Additionally, what are your thoughts about a line voltage track head with a screw in LED lamp vs a track head that is LED?
Pros and cons...

Thanks!

My opinion:
LEDs last a long time, but WHEN they eventually burn out (not if, but when), replacing a "bulb" type is a HECK of a lot easier than replacing the entire track head, especially if the head is no longer made by the time it burns out!