Island receptacles

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electricguy61

electricguy61

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Remotely running business in Bay Area, CA from Med
I came up with a solution to a problem, and was wondering if anyone could site a code restriction(s) to it.

The customer has a kitchen island, and did not want receptacles mounted or cut into the under-counter area. My thought was to install the receptacle just inside the door of the cabinet. It is within 6" of the counter-top, and is GFCI protected, but is hidden from view until needed, then the user simply opens the cabinet door.

I'd appreciate any thoughts you may have on this idea.

Thanks
 
I think the exception to 210.52(C)(5) would allow it. I also think it is a bad design. Any cord plugged into that receptacle is at risk of damage, if someone tries to close the cabinet door.
 
I disagree. I find this installation to not be code compliant. If the receptacle is in an appliance garage it is okay but does not qualify as the required counter receptacle. (art. 210.52(C)(5).. IMO,the door nixes this installation as code compliant for the required receptacle.
 
flexible cords

flexible cords

400.8 prohibits flexible cords running through doorways or were subject to damage.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I disagree. I find this installation to not be code compliant. If the receptacle is in an appliance garage it is okay but does not qualify as the required counter receptacle. (art. 210.52(C)(5).. IMO,the door nixes this installation as code compliant for the required receptacle.
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I agree with dennis 210.52 (C) (5) Won't allow it.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I disagree. I find this installation to not be code compliant. If the receptacle is in an appliance garage it is okay but does not qualify as the required counter receptacle. (art. 210.52(C)(5).. IMO,the door nixes this installation as code compliant for the required receptacle.
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Please explain how this code section nixes opening a cabinet door to access the receptacle. I don't see it.

Not arguing, asking for clarification.

Thanks
 
The receptacle located within the cabinet (with the door) is not permitted.

210.52 dwelling Unit Receptacle Outlets

This section provides requirements for 125-volt, 15- and - 20 ampere receptacle outlets. Receptacle outlets required by this section shall be in addition to any receptacle that is part of a luminaire or appliance, located within cabinets or cupboards, or located more than 5 1/2 feet above the floor.
 
I had a brilliant reply, but I had to withdraw it. Pierre just trumped teh brilliance of my brilliant reply. I yield. Thought I will offer a reminder that I did think it was a bad design. :rolleyes:
 
Pierre's article reference is a good one to remember when laying out receptacles in living rooms and dens. Often there are cabinets with doors on them and the recep. that you put in there will not suffice for code required receptacles. I have seen this very often and I believe it is another of those codes that do not get enforced as it should.

I hate it when I come back to trim and the entire wall has cabinets (not originally on the plan but later added) with doors and I have to retro fit outlets in the kick space.
 
I hate it when I come back to trim and the entire wall has cabinets (not originally on the plan but later added) with doors and I have to retro fit outlets in the kick space.
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Do cabinets installed on the walls count as uninterrupted wall space. If not, then you are not required by code to install the receptacles in the kick space. :smile:
 
IllinoisContractor said:
Do cabinets installed on the walls count as uninterrupted wall space. If not, then you are not required by code to install the receptacles in the kick space. :smile:
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Wall space is wall space. Cabinets are cabinets. Think of a pantry or think of the lower cabinets in a kitchen.
What I am saying is cabinets are not considered wall space and would not require receptacle placement as per 210.52(A)(2).
 
Pierre C Belarge said:
Wall space is wall space. Cabinets are cabinets. Think of a pantry or think of the lower cabinets in a kitchen.
What I am saying is cabinets are not considered wall space and would not require receptacle placement as per 210.52(A)(2).
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The inspectors around here think differently, every library I ever wired had to have receptacles installed in the baseboard, And I would love a definition of wall space please... also, if I built a wall out of cabinets you would not require receptacles to be installed?
 
The inspectors around here think differently, every library I ever wired had to have receptacles installed in the baseboard
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If I were to submit a proposal that included a room that had floor to ceiling cabinets, without a counter top anywhere in between, I would not include receptacles to be installed in the kick plate. I would include receptacles within 6 feet of the cabinets but not in the cabinet themselves. If I had an inspector come in at the final and tell me that I needed to cut in receptacles in the kick plates, I would have to seriously debate the issue with him. I'm not saying that I would win the debate, but I would definitely debate it with him because he would be wrong. I have a hard time when an inspector causes me to incur additional cost just because he feels that he can. It doesn't matter if he can show me the code requirements, he just says to do it because that's the way he wants it.:mad:
 
Charlie, I agreed with you without doing my own research and look what happened. I'm deeply hurt.

My point about the customer can't always have what they want, was meant as, an outlet is required there and you're going to have one like it or not and as an inspector I may or may not have allowed it. Somedays it just depends on my mood. : )
 
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Pierre C Belarge said:
The receptacle located within the cabinet (with the door) is not permitted.

210.52 dwelling Unit Receptacle Outlets

This section provides requirements for 125-volt, 15- and - 20 ampere receptacle outlets. Receptacle outlets required by this section shall be in addition to any receptacle that is part of a luminaire or appliance, located within cabinets or cupboards, or located more than 5 1/2 feet above the floor.
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That would seem to cover it, though it does not dis-allow it.

Thanks
 
IllinoisContractor said:
If I were to submit a proposal that included a room that had floor to ceiling cabinets, without a counter top anywhere in between, I would not include receptacles to be installed in the kick plate. I would include receptacles within 6 feet of the cabinets but not in the cabinet themselves. If I had an inspector come in at the final and tell me that I needed to cut in receptacles in the kick plates, I would have to seriously debate the issue with him. I'm not saying that I would win the debate, but I would definitely debate it with him because he would be wrong. I have a hard time when an inspector causes me to incur additional cost just because he feels that he can. It doesn't matter if he can show me the code requirements, he just says to do it because that's the way he wants it.:mad:
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I should have said, he required the receptacles, I just happened to install them in the toe kick, but really, how can you call a fastened piece of cabinetry not wall space?
 
electricguy61 said:
That would seem to cover it, though it does not dis-allow it.

Thanks
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It doesn't forbid a receptacle from being inside a cabinet - but it does disallow it from being counted as the required receptacle, IMO.

Now the question becomes, what if I install in-use covers on my island...?

;)
 
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