jumping out pole line insulators on anchors and other supporting hardware? are utilities actually doing this

[mikeshea]

I have gotten embroiled in a Facebook discussion with a lot of claims that utilities and other entities are installing jumpers across the insulators on pole line guys and stays, anchors etc. Ostensibly to bond them or use the anchor as an electrode. I have retired and only know Canadian pole line standards and BC Hydro standards.
Is this actually credible and can anyone offer any rational for it? Why even install an insulator then jumper it out?

 

[ramsy]

Why even install an insulator then jumper it out?

Insulators allow power lines to be mechanical supported, without energizing the support structure.

Are not the jumpers required to get power around the insulators?

Perhaps the jumpers also prevent discharge losses in wet weather.

 

[mikeshea]

Insulators allow power lines to be mechanical supported, without energizing the support structure.

Are not the jumpers required to get power around the insulators?

Perhaps the jumpers also prevent discharge losses in wet weather.

I am talking about the supporting structures like the terminal guy on a pole or the anchors where lines change direction. Not the actual power lines. the guy wires have an insulator installed to prevent the anchor from being energized by a fault and people are jumping them out? Why put an insulator in then bypass it?

 

[jim dungar]

I am talking about the supporting structures like the terminal guy on a pole or the anchors where lines change direction. Not the actual power lines. the guy wires have an insulator installed to prevent the anchor from being energized by a fault and people are jumping them out? Why put an insulator in then bypass it?

Is it possible the original system was ungrounded and the utility increased their capacity by converting to a Wye system and now they need multi grounded neutrals?

 

[mikeshea]

Is it possible the original system was ungrounded and the utility increased their capacity by converting to a Wye system and now they need multi grounded neutrals?

I can imagine they do that but ungrounded distribution in BC or most of Canada is pretty rare. our standards (non utility) would not allow using support structures for grounding and a rod or pole buttplate would have to be installed. I also have some concern that they are just being lazy and cheap as anchors are not regular or evenly distributed. A long pole run can go miles without an anchor so they must also be driving rods and it isn't like a rod is difficult for a pole maintenance truck to push into the earth. For the most part the insulator is a safety measure as well where a ground wire is installed it is usually under a guard on the pole. Using the anchor and the repurposed anchor wire is exposed. I understand a ground is not intended to carry current but it happens whenever the neutral is damaged or a connection gets resistive. We also have some ground return neutrals in very rural areas of Alberta. I have certainly seen pole fires caused by the ground wire carrying current.

 

[Elect117]

Are these on steel poles or non wood poles or is this happening on all poles?

Are these guys in the power space or in the communication space? Communication doesn't normally cut in insulators.

 

[mikeshea]

Are these on steel poles or non wood poles or is this happening on all poles?

Are these guys in the power space or in the communication space? Communication doesn't normally cut in insulators.

the poles I saw were wood and the installation was in the US as opposed to Canada where I live. our utilities use the same standard for support structures, pole depth and grounding where installed Many poles are joint use as well but a power line on one side of the road and a communications on the other would use the same standard except for pole length as communications pole are generally shorter. While utilities can use their own standards, they all refer to the non utility standard for pole line installations especially for the support of poles.

 

[Elect117]

I have two different things I could think of for by passing the cut-in insulator for power.

1) It isn't for power but for communication and they are using the guy for grounding. The contractor for the communication company messed up and then had to go back and rebond.

2) A wizzer or similar. Where the power utility cuts in an insulator on the messenger neutral when they shouldn't have and then needs to run a jumper.

I can't think of any other reasons to.

 

[mikeshea]

I have two different things I could think of for by passing the cut-in insulator for power.

1) It isn't for power but for communication and they are using the guy for grounding. The contractor for the communication company messed up and then had to go back and rebond.

2) A wizzer or similar. Where the power utility cuts in an insulator on the messenger neutral when they shouldn't have and then needs to run a jumper.

I can't think of any other reasons to.

in our non utility, overhead guide a terminal stay (the one at the last pole) has a clevis bolt, a steel multi strand wire of about 3 feet, an insulator then another section of steel wire if it crosses any secondary power lower on the pole and another insulator somewhere near 8 feet above grade then more steel wire and an anchor screwed or buried into the ground. They go to great trouble to isolate this steel wire from the ground and any anchor. It strikes me as odd that anyone would use that as an electrode later. Since I infer that the pole in the discussion was supplying residential area makes me think it was never an ungrounded overhead they never too a long shot of the location but from the ensuing discussion a lot of replies indicate this jumper was installed intentionally and maybe even by the utility?
I know that BC Hydro simply would not vary from their overhead standards as they are incredibly sticky about following their rules. I can only say I get a different sense of what might happen outside of Canada.
thanks for the replies. it seems like these practices are not as common as I was getting the impression of.

 

[Elect117]

in our non utility, overhead guide a terminal stay (the one at the last pole) has a clevis bolt, a steel multi strand wire of about 3 feet, an insulator then another section of steel wire if it crosses any secondary power lower on the pole and another insulator somewhere near 8 feet above grade then more steel wire and an anchor screwed or buried into the ground. They go to great trouble to isolate this steel wire from the ground and any anchor. It strikes me as odd that anyone would use that as an electrode later. Since I infer that the pole in the discussion was supplying residential area makes me think it was never an ungrounded overhead they never too a long shot of the location but from the ensuing discussion a lot of replies indicate this jumper was installed intentionally and maybe even by the utility?
I know that BC Hydro simply would not vary from their overhead standards as they are incredibly sticky about following their rules. I can only say I get a different sense of what might happen outside of Canada.
thanks for the replies. it seems like these practices are not as common as I was getting the impression of.

A wizzer (which I am guessing is a name given by the construction in the field) is a method of running the bare neutral as a kind of messenger / guy wire. You then install a tensioned dead end when you are ready to 90° off to the weatherhead.

Similar to how communication companies mid span tap their lines to feed homes.

You would need to then to cut in an isolate prior to hitting the next pole. Or, if you grounded at the next pole instead, you might not need to cut in an isolator?

I don't know. It is hard to guess at this without photos.

 

[jaggedben]

I have gotten embroiled in a Facebook discussion with a lot of claims ...

And you're taking that seriously?