Kitchen appliances
- Thread starter TTwizted
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texie
Senior Member
- Location
- Fort Collins, Colorado
- Occupation
- Electrician, Contractor, Inspector
Have you studied 210.52?
- Location
- Tennessee NEC:2017
- Occupation
- Semi-Retired Electrician
I usually put the fridge on a separate/dedicated circuit. The code allows it to either be on the SABC or a dedicated circuit.
The only time I put a microwave on a separate circuit is when it is an over the range w/hood. Now the mfg might say it needs one for a counter top unit but I never do. There may be times where there are several high amp draw appliances that would be on with the MW. If this is known I would run another circuit. Not necessarily a dedicated one, just an extra one. Or I might split the receptacles up, like recep. #1 on kitchen circuit #1, recep #2 on kitchen circuit #2, and back and forth like that.
The only time I put a microwave on a separate circuit is when it is an over the range w/hood. Now the mfg might say it needs one for a counter top unit but I never do. There may be times where there are several high amp draw appliances that would be on with the MW. If this is known I would run another circuit. Not necessarily a dedicated one, just an extra one. Or I might split the receptacles up, like recep. #1 on kitchen circuit #1, recep #2 on kitchen circuit #2, and back and forth like that.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
I'd be inclined to run as many separate circuits as you think you might need. You'd be surprised how many electric appliances some people use at the same time. It doesn't cost a whole lot of front add a bunch of dedicated circuits and you might appreciate having them down the road.
junkhound
Senior Member
- Location
- Renton, WA
- Occupation
- EE, power electronics specialty
Your own kitchen? Married? Have kids? Any hungry teenagers?
Forget code MINIMUMS, go for separate circuits for fridge, freezer, microwave (make space for at least TWO microwaves, each on separate outlet) and at least 3 other breakers with quad outlets. If you have a larger coffee maker, even a separate outlet for that, and separate for garbage disposal if you have one. Don't forget the toaster(s) and dishwasher.
Minimum of 7 circuits to kitchen for a new or remodeled kitchen, unless you are single and almost never cook, then code minimums OK.
If I had my own house to do over, I'd have a 20 space 100 A minimum sub-panel for the kitchen if SE/main panel is more than ten feet away !
Code requirement is 2 small appliance 20 amp circuits. If MW is built-in it needs a separate 20 amp circuit. MW over the range is considered a built-in. A MW alcove or cabinet shelf for a portable MW is recommended to have a sep 20 amp circuit, but not required. Often, the refrigerator is put on a separate circuit. In Calif, per 2016 CEC, GFCI protection not required for dedicated refrigeration equipment, so usually , separate circuit for refrig. I like adding circuits, but do not like paying $48 each for AFCI circuit breakers which are required for everything in the kitchen. Even the receptacle AFCI cost $30, but then you need to run AC or MC cable to the first outlet....which costs even more.
Why would u need to run mc or ac cable to the first outlet?
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texie
Senior Member
- Location
- Fort Collins, Colorado
- Occupation
- Electrician, Contractor, Inspector
See 210.12(A)(5).
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Bottom line NEC doesn't require any dedicated circuits to either appliance in OP's scenario.
Smart design may still be to run more than the minimum 2 required SABC's. From load calculation perspective that will add 1500 VA per additional SABC, not normally too big of an issue if only adding one to three more circuits, add 10 more SABC's and that is probably significant to the load calculation.
Smart design may still be to run more than the minimum 2 required SABC's. From load calculation perspective that will add 1500 VA per additional SABC, not normally too big of an issue if only adding one to three more circuits, add 10 more SABC's and that is probably significant to the load calculation.
So 210.12(a)1 says afci breaker to protect the entire branch circuit or like u said in 210.12(a)5 I would need a afci outlet and need to use mc or ac cable to protect the circuit right?
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kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Yes, but generally will be more cost effective to use an AFCI breaker, or even dual function AFCI/GFCI if GFCI protection is also needed. Plus GFCI's and AFCI's also need to be readily accessible, and the breaker in the panel is likely going to comply already because the panel itself will also need to comply to similar rule. See 210.8 as well as 210.12 wording, part before even getting to subpart (A) in either section - they both require ready accessibility.
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
In an average home, I'll usually use the required two circuits, plus put the dining room on with the fridge or microwave.
In a high-end home, I'll typically place only two receptacles on each appliance circuit, plus two dedicated for fridge and MW
In a high-end home, I'll typically place only two receptacles on each appliance circuit, plus two dedicated for fridge and MW
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Can only do the dining room with microwave if the microwave is utilizing a receptacle permitted to be on a SABC. Over range or in a cabinet would not be permitted, on the counter MW would be.
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