Labeling a panel with (E) - emergency designation when there is no emergency source.

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J-InTheJ-Box

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Ok guru's this one has me raising a red flag. A little back story, I have a building I'm doing a reno on, a new fire alarm panel went in and it was circuited to a normal source panel. There is no emergency source available for this building. The fire alarm panel has its own internal battery backup, fine, right? Here's the rub. My client wishes to add E for emergency to the name of the panel just because it contains the circuit for the fire alarm. So, instead of calling the panel ABC, they want it to be ABCE. Does calling it or labeling it as emergency when it is not break the rules or am I fretting over nothing? A pointer to the specific wording in The Code would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
 
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J-InTheJ-Box said:
Ok guru's this one has me raising a red flag. A little back story, I have a building I'm doing a reno on, a new fire alarm panel went in and it was circuited to a normal source panel. There is no emergency source available for this building. The fire alarm panel has its own internal battery backup, fine, right? Here's the rub. My client wishes to add E for emergency to the name of the panel just because it contains the circuit for the fire alarm. So, instead of calling the panel ABC, they want it to be ABCE. Does calling it or labeling it as emergency when it is not break the rules or am I fretting over nothing? A pointer to the specific wording in The Code would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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i don't see an issue with just labeling it as ABCE.
 
While there may be no code issue, when the AHJ starts looking at it, he's going to want to know where the generator is, load calculations, did you protect the cables to the panel, etc, etc. And he/she won't get it out of their head this is not for an Article 700 system. Avoid this sort of thing at all costs.
 
gadfly56 said:
While there may be no code issue, when the AHJ starts looking at it, he's going to want to know where the generator is, load calculations, did you protect the cables to the panel, etc, etc. And he/she won't get it out of their head this is not for an Article 700 system. Avoid this sort of thing at all costs.
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So we can't label a panel "Panel E" because an AHJ who doesn't know any better might think it's an "Emergency" Panel?

I don't think so.

JAP>
 
jap said:
So we can't label a panel "Panel E" because an AHJ who doesn't know any better might think it's an "Emergency" Panel?

I don't think so.

JAP>
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Sure you can. Just don't use the word "Emergency" on the label. It wasn't clear to me that the owner was just going to use "E" or if the OP was short-handing that for "Emergency". And for God's sake don't tell the AJH "Oh yeah, "E" stands for "emergency"" because that will also start the poop storm.
 
gadfly56 said:
Sure you can. Just don't use the word "Emergency" on the label. It wasn't clear to me that the owner was just going to use "E" or if the OP was short-handing that for "Emergency". And for God's sake don't tell the AJH "Oh yeah, "E" stands for "emergency"" because that will also start the poop storm.
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I agree with not using the word "emergency". using the letter "E" as part of your panel designation is a completely different thing.
 
petersonra said:
I agree with not using the word "emergency". using the letter "E" as part of your panel designation is a completely different thing.
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And both of these actual scenarios fail miserably when not actually referring to and actual "Emergency" panel.

Yea we could argue Code issues or not, but, there's still something to be said for the normality of things.

I hope the OP can convince his client not to re-label the panel.

He seems to be wanting to do so for all the wrong reasons.

JAP>
 
MichaelGP3 said:
Unless the 'E' is a prefix. Then it is not a completely different thing. :happysad:
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You're absolutely correct.

In that scenario, an inspector that didn't know any better would think my panels labeled E101, E102 and E104 were actually "Plan Sheets" instead of Panelboards. :)


JAP>
 
They want E added to the label, not the full word emergency. But, if I put E on the label, I have to add its meaning on the symbols and abbreviations legend at the front of the construction documents. Will the client being it own AHJ make any difference? Its a university.

I agree with with every bodies assertions that this just isn't good practice. I have a few days yet before I need to respond to the RFI.
 
I can't see that I have ever seen emergency panels labeled with the prefix "E" though. As often as not they are just labeled EMERGENCY, or something similar. Maybe in your area the practice is different and the prefix "E" substitutes for the word EMERGENCY.
 
Should I respond and tell them to put a label on the panel with "Fire Alarm Circuited To This Panel" or something like that? If the purpose is to visually identify the panel as being the source for the fire alarm circuit, what other methods should I argue for instead of the "E" suffix?

I appreciate all of your responses, you guys are great!
 
J-InTheJ-Box said:
Should I respond and tell them to put a label on the panel with "Fire Alarm Circuited To This Panel" or something like that? If the purpose is to visually identify the panel as being the source for the fire alarm circuit, what other methods should I argue for instead of the "E" suffix?

I appreciate all of your responses, you guys are great!
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I think your getting caught up too much on the "E" suffix.

I've witnessed several panelboards with a suffix of "E" that weren't actually emergency panels.

As far as what a symbol legend might indicate, most "E" symbols on a legend come with a clarification that "When indicated next to a lighting Fixture" it either contained an emergency ballast or was fed from an emergency circuit.

I've never seen such a note on a legend that referred an "E" to a panelboard as Emergency.
That's generally on the one-line or on the panel schedules themselves.

To my knowledge, there's no issue with the request to label the panel with a suffix of "E" or even "Emergency" for that matter.

Think of it this way. What's to keep a business owner, who's name of the business just happened to be "Emergency" from labeling his panels "Emergency Panel 1" "Emergency Panel 2" and so on?
 
J-InTheJ-Box said:
Should I respond and tell them to put a label on the panel with "Fire Alarm Circuited To This Panel" or something like that? If the purpose is to visually identify the panel as being the source for the fire alarm circuit, what other methods should I argue for instead of the "E" suffix?

I appreciate all of your responses, you guys are great!
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You don't identify the panel board as housing the fire alarm circuit. At the fire alarm panel you have to permanently mark or label or indicate which board and circuit feed the fire alarm panel. "PP-12A, CKT #37", for example. Typically we've used magic marker or a "P"-Touch label on the inside of the fire alarm door to do this.
 
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