Latest code changes.

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jamesboy123

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I recently had a conversation with a colleague of mine and he felt that some of the code changes over the years are
driven by the manufactures.
Let’s just take the Arc Fault circuit breakers that are so widely required.
Of course this would certainly lead to millions of dollars flowing to the circuit breaker manufacturers but Could they
Actually pushed for the requirement.
I guess the question really comes down to “ are the servicing electricians and public and even property safer now”
Would like to read the opinions from some of the other board members.
 
One merely need to read the Report on Proposals for all proposals made to change the NEC. Who made the proposal is included with the CMPs action.
 
480sparky- I am fairly certain most of us Electricians simply comply with the code changes without investigating who proposed them to the CMP. Heck I bet most of us do not even know who the CMP is or where to find that information and that’s even if there were time during everyone’s busy day.
My post was only looking for a simple and light discussion on others views, plus even if the research were done it still wouldn’t answer the question as to our safety.
 
I am sure manufacturers have pushed products to make money but in the same sense some of those products have made the electrical world safer.

Gfci were hated when they came out but they have saved many lives I am sure... The code making panels (cmp) are made up of some manufacturer engineers and inspectors, electricians, etc. They would certainly have to convince more than one member to get their products approved in the NEC.
 
The copper industry pushed HARD for conductor ampacity adjustments on roofs and used false and misleading tests to prove the need for the code change. The result was in the 2014 code and having to ridiculously oversize conductors on roofs. So yes industry does effect code. Luckily people realized that this was never an issue before and did some other test to disprove the need for the crazy ampacity adjustments and the code was amended in 2017. I do believe GFCI's work and save lives. I do not agree with them having to be in all the situations that they are required on in the 2020 code on certain commercial circuits.. AFCI's are crap, they may get better but I don't believe the current ones do much for safety.
 
jamesboy123 said:
I recently had a conversation with a colleague of mine and he felt that some of the code changes over the years are
driven by the manufactures.
Let’s just take the Arc Fault circuit breakers that are so widely required.
Of course this would certainly lead to millions of dollars flowing to the circuit breaker manufacturers but Could they
Actually pushed for the requirement.
I guess the question really comes down to “ are the servicing electricians and public and even property safer now”
Would like to read the opinions from some of the other board members.
Click to expand...

Not just driven by manufacturers, manufacturers caused their products to be written into code by infiltrating the CMPs as voting members and presenting flawed data that supported their biased positions. In short, the NEC has been bought.

There are pages and pages on this forum talking about AFCIs and how they are the biggest fraud on the American people since snake oil. They have NEVER been shown (least of all proven) to have saved even one life contrary to what the manufacturers tell the public.

Not only do they cost the public millions of dollars upfront to pay for them, there is the cost to the public and the electricians who install them because of nuisance tripping and other design issues which happen on an ongoing basis.

GFCIs were mentioned. A good product that they are getting greedy with by ever increasing the requirements into areas where the benefit is small, all in the name of increasing manufacturer's profits once again.

Think about TR receptacles also and add them to the list.

-Hal
 
GFCIs are a proven safety product, but some of the recent requirements have no justification, IE water coolers. One person who worked as an AHJ once said "the manufacturers have hijacked the code".
AFCIs, it will be years before we have hatd evidence.
 
jamesboy123 said:
480sparky- I am fairly certain most of us Electricians simply comply with the code changes without investigating who proposed them to the CMP. Heck I bet most of us do not even know who the CMP is or where to find that information and that’s even if there were time during everyone’s busy day.
My post was only looking for a simple and light discussion on others views, plus even if the research were done it still wouldn’t answer the question as to our safety.
Click to expand...
That may be true but not here on these forums, most know what they are and where to find them. A good number of the members here have made proposals and had them accepted, Dennis for one. Go to the NFPA website and register, then read till your eyes are worn out.

Roger
 
I agree that manufactures do have a lot to do with code changes along with injuries and death due to whatever issue us being addressed


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sparky1118 said:
I agree that manufactures do have a lot to do with code changes along with injuries and death due to whatever issue us being addressed
Click to expand...

Like the kid who burned his elbow from sticking something into a receptacle? The manufacturers used that picture as justification for TR receptacles. Usually the data they come up with looks legit on the surface but is very much open to speculation.

-Hal
 
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